AJs against agressor

rigoletto · #1 01-01-2005, 09:03 PM

NL turney, early rounds.

Short stack (450) makes minimum raise UTG, MP (2500) raises to 450. Seems to me he's making a move, so I (1500) call with AcJc. Short stack folds.

Flop: (pot 1025) Kc Qs 9c

MP bets 525, I go all in.

Lloyd · #2 01-02-2005, 04:45 AM

I'd fold this pre-flop. AJ is just too often dominated for me to feel comfortable playing when I hit my ace. Given that you played it, I don't see anything wrong with your push. It certainly looks like you're on a draw but if you made a normal raise you'd be pot committed anyway so pushing seems to be the reasonable alternative. You've got plenty of outs.

zaxx19 · #3 01-02-2005, 05:54 AM

Making a move with what?? Anythink AJ can beat?? Very doubtful in my book but feel free....and I dont care what he had I muck here without even a thought. Is AJ the new LAG AK now unreal. Like seriously early in tourneys is the mindset to try and build stacks at any risk with you guys...it might not be a horrible strategy but seems like thats the way alot of people are playing..I mean its AJ ...I limp with this UTG early in tourneys.. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

rigoletto · #4 01-02-2005, 06:31 AM

It seemed to me that raising to the exact amount of shortstacks stack would indicate a hand that really wouldn't like to be called, so I guessed suited broadway, suited AQ-A9 or a pocket pair TT or lower.

zaxx19 · #5 01-02-2005, 06:49 AM

Or he didnt want to stop others from coming in and making a move with a hand like AJ...works both ways doesnt it?? AJ is still AJ. And early in a tourney very rarely do I put my stack at risk with AJ a hand that is so easily dominated in raised pots. I understand you cant be overly dogmatic in a game like NLH but I just cant see how AJ is a hand I make a move with here persoanlly..I mean everything has to be perfect for me to be 45% or somthing...I understand If he is snapped off i get great odds but...Im not gonna put myelf in a hole early bc I made a move with a crummy AJ.

rigoletto · #6 01-02-2005, 03:15 PM

OK, thanks zaxx.

Just for the curious: MP called with TT (no clubs), I caught an ace on the river and after winning the hand he called me a fish, which is hereby confirmed.

davidross · #7 01-02-2005, 04:03 PM

I really hate the pre-flop call. It's a third of your chips, and you're going to have to play post-flop. If you read him for a move, then move in on him here and put him to the test. When you move in on the flop you have to expect a call, he's getting 2.5 to 1 on his call. His call with TT though seems really bad.

AJ is just a bad hand in NL. You won't win many big hands with it. I muck this pre-flop almost every time unless I have a strong read he's making a play and will lay it down.

rigoletto · #8 01-02-2005, 04:28 PM

Point taken. I was considering the preflop all-in, but figured this was a hand I wanted to see a flop with given my read. One question: yes I'm risking a third of my stack, but I'm still in good shape even if I fold on the flop. Would you never risk this amount early if you knew it was an even money call with potential to hit a big flop (I'm not refering to this hand, but the general concept)?

I'm asking because I see a lot of autrocious play in the early rounds and it seems to be a good time for a decent player to build his stack by seeing flops with good (if not stellar) hands.

Also: what if MP had just called the minimum raise. Wouldn't the domimation theory still apply and you should muck AJs? I'm just trying to understand the concept here. Being a limit player I find it hard to throw AJs to a small raise.

PS: nice to see you in the money last night. I finished third. I didn't show you mercy either, I folded AQo on the J high flop when you had raised UTG.

Lloyd · #9 01-02-2005, 05:42 PM

[ QUOTE ]
but figured this was a hand I wanted to see a flop with given my read.

[/ QUOTE ]

Your read is exactly why you DON'T want to see a flop. If your read is correct then a re-raise all-in will win the pot right then. If you call and see a flop you have no idea what you're up against. He could be making a move with T8 and the flop comes AT8. Looks good for you, right?

davidross · #10 01-02-2005, 06:35 PM

WHen the raise is this big in relation to the blinds I don't see any hands I'm calling with. With small raises I like to call with pairs and suited connectors (but not aces). To play for an amount this big I want to believe I'm best before the flop.