river flush action

bicyclekick · #1 09-05-2004, 04:25 AM

UTG+1 is a typical party player.

Party Poker 15/30 Hold'em (9 handed)

Preflop: Hero is SB with 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
UTG folds, UTG+1 calls, MP1 calls, MP2 folds, MP3 calls, CO calls, Button folds, Hero completes, BB checks.

Flop: (6 SB) K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (6 players)
Hero checks, BB checks, UTG+1 checks, MP1 checks, MP3 checks, CO checks.

Turn: (3 BB) K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (6 players)
Hero bets, BB folds, UTG+1 raises, MP1 folds, MP3 folds, CO folds, Hero calls.

River: (7 BB) 6[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero bets, UTG+1 raises, Hero ?

Enon · #2 09-05-2004, 08:08 AM

Its exactly these kinds of situations on Party 15/30 that makes me think online poker is detrimental to playing 'real' poker (i.e. live poker).

These kinds of calls on the river have been unthinking and automatic for me (which i hate). It looks like you're beat by a slowplayed set that filled up or Ax[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] that semi-bluff raised the turn, but you never know against the wide range of crazies in the 15/30 game.

Make the crying call and save these types of laydowns for when you have a feel for the player and/or can actually take a second to sit back in your chair and look your opponent over.

stoxtrader · #3 09-05-2004, 08:11 AM

I'm guessing that kick wants to know whether he should call or raise, and while I think the is a decent chance you are against three kings only, I call here as you will lose two bets the times you are behind.

SpaceAce · #4 09-05-2004, 09:57 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Make the crying call and save these types of laydowns for when you have a feel for the player and/or can actually take a second to sit back in your chair and look your opponent over.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm not crying too hard when I make this call. The real question is should the hero raise? I don't think so but not calling is nowhere on my radar screen.

SpaceAce

chesspain · #5 09-05-2004, 12:29 PM

[ QUOTE ]
UTG+1 is a typical party player.

Party Poker 15/30 Hold'em (9 handed)

Preflop: Hero is SB with 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
UTG folds, UTG+1 calls, MP1 calls, MP2 folds, MP3 calls, CO calls, Button folds, Hero completes, BB checks.

[/ QUOTE ]

Is this an auto-call in a 1/3 blind structure?

bdk3clash · #6 09-05-2004, 01:07 PM

The Party 15/30 has a 2/3 blind structure--the SB is $10. Part of the reason it tends to be such an action game, I guess.

Folding here getting 10:1 with a flush would just be silly. This could easily be trip Kings, though I would think UTG+1 would have bet the flop with KT or KJ or whatever. 55/99 also make sense. I dunno, I think this is really close between calling and raising. I doubt he's giving you credit for a runner-runner flush, but him not betting the flop makes me think he doesn't have a bare K.

I guess I'd just call (after wondering what the hell I'm doing in a 15/30 game...) since you'll probably get 3-bet by hands that beat you, gaining 1 BB when you're ahead and losing 2 when you're behind.

bicyclekick · #7 09-05-2004, 01:13 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I'm guessing that kick wants to know whether he should call or raise, and while I think the is a decent chance you are against three kings only, I call here as you will lose two bets the times you are behind.

[/ QUOTE ]

Precisely. I wasn't thinking about folding. I really didn't even consider 3 betting or folding and pretty much auto-called. red_rain was sweating me and berated me for quite some time for not 3 betting him. He called me a super puss.

I just thought my hand should be pretty obvious to anyone who's at all paying attention.

bicyclekick · #8 09-05-2004, 01:14 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
UTG+1 is a typical party player.

Party Poker 15/30 Hold'em (9 handed)

Preflop: Hero is SB with 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
UTG folds, UTG+1 calls, MP1 calls, MP2 folds, MP3 calls, CO calls, Button folds, Hero completes, BB checks.

[/ QUOTE ]

Is this an auto-call in a 1/3 blind structure?

[/ QUOTE ]

Hell, I woulda called Q3o in that spot.

Enon · #9 09-05-2004, 01:24 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Make the crying call and save these types of laydowns for when you have a feel for the player and/or can actually take a second to sit back in your chair and look your opponent over.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm not crying too hard when I make this call. The real question is should the hero raise? I don't think so but not calling is nowhere on my radar screen.

SpaceAce

[/ QUOTE ]

I think I give my party 15 opponents too much credit sometimes. [img]/images/graemlins/blush.gif[/img]

RED_RAIN · #10 09-05-2004, 01:56 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I guess I'd just call (after wondering what the hell I'm doing in a 15/30 game...) since you'll probably get 3-bet by hands that beat you, gaining 1 BB when you're ahead and losing 2 when you're behind.

[/ QUOTE ]

I can understand that if "you" 3-bet, and then get capped, yes you are likely behind.

I guess I would argue, 9s often would be PFRed. So against 5s we are losing. Yes we also lose to K9, K6, K5. But I would think most realistically pocket 5s if we lose this hand.

So the arguement of gaining 1 BB when you're ahead and 2 when you're behind I would have to say that I just think you are ahead more often than the times you will lose your 2 BB when you are behind.

I also doubt he thinks you got the runner runner flush. I just have a feeling that it's a good 3 bet here.