Nut flush on the flop

prrthd · #1 08-25-2004, 12:05 PM

I checked on the flop because with 5 people someone was going to bet out at the pot and I didn't want to scare people out. The turn went horribly wrong, I was going to check raise since I assumed the Button would bet again..... and then the river.

Party Poker 0.50/1 Hold'em (9 handed)

Preflop: Hero is MP1 with 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
UTG folds, UTG+1 folds, Hero calls, MP2 folds, MP3 calls, CO folds, Button calls, SB completes, BB checks.

Flop: (5 SB) K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (5 players)
SB checks, BB checks, Hero checks, MP3 checks, Button bets, SB folds, BB folds, Hero calls, MP3 calls.

Turn: (4 BB) 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (3 players)
Hero checks, MP3 checks, Button checks.

River: (4 BB) T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (3 players)
Hero bets, MP3 raises, Button folds, Hero 3-bets, MP3 caps, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 12 BB

Results in white below: 
Hero shows 9d Ad (flush, ace high).
MP3 shows Tc Kh (full house, tens full of kings).
Outcome: MP3 wins 12 BB.

sin808 · #2 08-25-2004, 12:09 PM

This is why you shouldn't slow play big hands in microlimits, imo....

dfscott · #3 08-25-2004, 12:13 PM

What Sin808 said...

Bet the flop, bet the turn, bet the river. Everyone will just think you're bluffing at the flop anyway. Anyone with a King will call.

sthief09 · #4 08-25-2004, 12:16 PM

definitely raise preflop, and it's not close. you shouldn't be limping with any hand in this spot. raise or fold once you're first in, in MP. bet the flop, bet the turn, and keep raising on the river. often enough he'll have just trips, so your river play is fine. but you learned why it's usually best to not slowplay. that guy was drawing to 4 outs and you gave him a free shot at them.

prrthd · #5 08-25-2004, 12:28 PM

Is there any time to slow play in the micros then? Maybe a flopped 4 of a kind?

radek2166 · #6 08-25-2004, 01:15 PM

Their is a post on a guy who slow played a floped set. Villan maded a st flush on the river.

He was staying either way floped 2 pair.

sthief09 · #7 08-25-2004, 01:21 PM

this is from a post I wrote yesterday:

here's a very general rule for slowplaying a set:

1. can 2 cards make an open-ended straight draw?
2. are there 2 or more broadway cards on the board
3. will your call give opponents greater than 7-1 odds to call?

This always MUST be true: you can make more money by slowplaying than by playing it fast. so often people slowplay in pots where they'd make more money by betting into loose opponents. don't let someone who's willing to call a bet see the next card for free.

if the answer to #1 or #2, and #3, is "yes" then don't slowplay. the reason for this is because for #1, if you can make an OESD on the board, then there are a lot of gut shots available as well, and your goal should be raising to make the gut shots fold. for #2, it means that an opponent will often have a straight draw because most players will play any 2 broadway cards in an unraised pot.

also consider if the board is suited. a player with a gut shot + backdoor flush draw doesn't need as good odds as someone with just the straight draw.

an example is with a board of A72. you can slowplay because the only hands that make draws are 34, 45, and 53, all of which are uncommon. on a board of AK6, you shouldn't slowplay if you're giving JT, QT, or QJ odds to call.

when it comes down to it, you'll usually make almost as much, or even more, by playing your set fast. your opponents are loose and will pay you off if they like their hands. so playing the hand fast mght lose you 1 BB, but it'll save you the pot once in a while.

dfscott · #8 08-25-2004, 01:24 PM

I agree with everything that sthief09 said. Also, you never want to slowplay if the pot is large -- just try to win it right there.

sthief09 · #9 08-25-2004, 01:24 PM

- the fact that the 2 pair would've called doesn't matter much. 2 pair is an 11-1 underdog to fill up. 2 pair then would've been incorrect to call the turn bet, getting only 5-1. he would've called, and you would've made money on him calling, but instead he got infinite odds to fill up.
- he would've built a bigger pot by just betting the flop and turn. a slowplay is worthless if it doesn't build the pot

radek2166 · #10 08-25-2004, 01:40 PM

I agree I was just telling the poster that the guy was comeing either way. You need to charge for cards. I have such a hard time getting a C/R to work I just bet somebody raise I reraise.