Two Turn Checks

[Michael Davis]

Hand #1: I limp on the button in an eight-way pot with Qh4h.

Flop: Qc 8d 3s

Checked to me, I bet. Only caller is solid player in SB. Alarms are going off in my head.

Turn: Qc 8d 3s (6d)

He checks, I check.

River is a rag, he checks and I bet...



Hand #2

I raise one limper in middle position with AcAd. Button, BB, and limper call and we go to the flop four ways. BB is a solid player.

Flop: Qc 7h 5c

BB bets, limper calls, I raise, button coldcalls, BB and limper call.

Turn: Qc 7h 5c (Qd)

Checked to me, I check, button checks.

River: Qc 7h 5c Qd (8c)

Checked to me, I bet...

-Michael

[DeeJ]

Hand #1 I play it like you. He may be in the same situation having a Q with a poor kicker, or maybe even just an 8. If he raises the river I'm folding.

Hand #2 I'm betting the turn. You will get raised by a Q
and anyone without will likely fold, apart from flush draws (or anyone with 3 of a kind) - they have to pay to carry on. As the flush hits, which sucks but you do have the Ace which might prevent a river raise to your bet. Any Queen will call, flushes or boats raising. So I go in earlier here.

[afish]

Hand 1:

Bet the turn. SB could easily have called with middle (or even bottom) pair. He's getting 9:1 on his money, and he is only an 4:1 dog to improve to two pair by the river. You can't give him a free card here. If check raised on the turn, fold.

Because you checked the turn, a river bet is automatic. I'd fold to a river check raise.

Hand 2:

Bet the turn. I don't think a Q would go for a check raise here, since you can easily check behind.

River is again, a no brainer.

[elysium]

hi mike
in hand 1), you can safely fold if check-raised, but might allow a free-card that can beat you; there are several. if there is a reasonable chance that this opponent will fold Q top pair with kicker problem, and this opponent might, then you should bet.

usually, when you are dragging the opponent down onto your turf at the river, because you think he's setting up a check-raise on the turn, and you would like to call 1 bet there, on the river, but not a check-raise and 1 on the river, you need a stronger hand than this one. if he will fold QTs or QJs to your bet, although he may check-raise, because of the other considerations, like the possibility of folding if he bets out on the river, and the fact that you'd like to see a free river showdown, a bet on the turn will stop a bluff on the river, and might take down the pot often enough here, that when you toss in the fact that you can easily fold to a check-raise, a bet on the turn is in order.

you can't be faulted for how you played it, though. the main problem is the possibility of his folding a hand that beats yours if you had bet the turn. the drag down to your home turf line works in the right spots, against the right opponent. you have all that, what you don't have though, are only weaker hands folding to your turn bet. if this opponent absolutely either wouldn't be in there with a kicker problem, or wouldn't fold top pair even with a weak kicker, then how you played it was fine.

hand 2) bet the turn to fold the draws or make them pay.

[anatta]

Hand 1: I wouldn't be too scared of the solid players call. Yes, he is in great position to raise and limit the field and there are no draws, but I would think he has middle or bottom pair and just wants to draw cheaply. He might reason that with eight to the flop (nice game!) someone has a queen, and will not fold it. So I would bet the turn.


Hand 2: I think its closer than most here, with this many seeing the turn somebody could have a queen, so you could need a free card. On the other hand, the BB betting out and the next player just calling on the flop doesn't necessarily mean top pair. The button could have a queen, but who knows? I think you can bet and fold to a raise or just check and call a bet on the end, in the long run doesn't mean much.