10/20 Party

Chaostracize · #1 03-24-2005, 03:28 AM

I feel a little silly posting this. I play mostly NL on Party but I wanted to play a little 10/20 because I was bored.

Anyway... 3 bet flop? Value bet river? Is this too basic?
I felt like the CO CR on the flop smelled like a flush draw since he would know no one was going to fold, so I figured he got there and was going for the CR on the river... fear that's justified?

Party Poker 10/20 Hold'em (8 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is Button with A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
1 fold, UTG+1 raises, 2 folds, CO calls, Hero 3-bets, SB calls, 1 fold, UTG+1 calls, CO calls.

Flop: (13 SB) 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (4 players)
SB checks, UTG+1 checks, CO checks, Hero bets, SB calls, UTG+1 calls, CO raises, Hero calls, SB calls, UTG+1 calls.

Turn: (10.50 BB) 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (4 players)
SB checks, UTG+1 checks, CO checks, Hero bets, SB calls, UTG+1 folds, CO calls.

River: (13.50 BB) 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (3 players)
SB checks, CO checks, Hero checks.

Final Pot: 13.50 BB

jgorham · #2 03-24-2005, 03:34 AM

Unless you have a specific read that UTG is a loose raiser, this is a PF fold.

On the flop I think it is a pretty easy 3bet, as CO could easily be raising a very wide range of hands here (remember you 3bet PF), and you have a bunch of equity against 3 opponents. If anyone is drawing you must make them pay the max, and the pot is fairly large so you also want to protect your hand while you have the chance.

Value bet this river. If you get checkraised you can reevaluate, but you can't be scared off the bat that you are behind.

lostinthought · #3 03-24-2005, 03:35 AM

I typically don't play AJo on the button to a raise and a cold call, but perhaps this is too tight?

On the flop, I think this is an easy 3-bet.

philnewall · #4 03-24-2005, 04:41 AM

I concur, fold preflop, 3 bet the flop. rest is ok.

bobbyi · #5 03-24-2005, 04:48 AM

[ QUOTE ]
I typically don't play AJo on the button to a raise and a cold call, but perhaps this is too tight?

[/ QUOTE ]
Given that the raise came from earlyish position, this isn't too tight.

KidPokerX · #6 03-24-2005, 05:01 AM

depending on your read I would probably 3-bet the flop. Take the lead and slow down when the heart comes (assuming you have him on the flush draw, which is most-likely how someone with a draw would play).
were you afraid of him having you beat by the flop reraise?

Chaostracize · #7 03-24-2005, 01:14 PM

So, my mistakes in levels of egregiousness are as follows:

1. 3-betting PF
2. Lack of 3-bet on flop
3. No value bet on river

TStoneMBD · #8 03-24-2005, 01:19 PM

definitely fold preflop. 3bet the flop. i think that your river check is fine. the way that CO played it, it certainly looks like he was on a flush draw and this is a good situation for him to checkraise you.

DcifrThs · #9 03-24-2005, 01:21 PM

[ QUOTE ]
So, my mistakes in levels of egregiousness are as follows:

1. 3-betting PF
2. Lack of 3-bet on flop
3. No value bet on river

[/ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]
So, my mistakes in levels of egregiousness are as follows:

1. 3-betting PF
2. Lack of 3-bet on flop
3. No value bet on river

[/ QUOTE ]

if by egregiousness you mean EV then i totally disagree with this evaluation of the size of the mistakes.

the preflop 3 bet is not even a mistake in my mind and if it is one its very very small. certainly should be # 3 on that list if its even on that list.

now i am not precisely sure between not 3 betting the flop and not value betting the river. the river is probably a small mistake as you will occasionally be checkraised and have to fold, and sometimes nobody will call but on the whole its probably a plus EV of between .2 and .5bbs maybe more.

but not 3betting the flop i think can cost you the pot if the sb has a hand he'd fold for 2 more cold that he's now CORRECT to call for 1 more bet.

so my order of size of mistakes from largest to smallest are:

1) not 3 betting the flop.
2) not value betting the river

3) 3betting pf (although i do this, player dependant, when necessary and dont necessarily consider it a mistake)

-Barron

DcifrThs · #10 03-24-2005, 01:25 PM

[ QUOTE ]
definitely fold preflop. 3bet the flop. i think that your river check is fine. the way that CO played it, it certainly looks like he was on a flush draw and this is a good situation for him to checkraise you.

[/ QUOTE ]

i think 3 betting pf is a small if a mistake. certaintly co looks like a flush draw, but he could also have a weak jack. if hero is checkraised...easy fold...but there's 2 people on the river who looked like their ready to go to a showdown and tptk is a winner almost every time when called.

-Barron