How the Tiffany Williamson story could have been better

betgo · #1 11-03-2005, 02:55 PM

If she had either
1. Busted Raymer with AJ vs. KK
2. Called with KJs against AA and doubled up against Shiek
3. Made the final table
4. No, she couldn't have won it all. Varkonyi and Furlong were much stronger players.

Toddy · #2 11-03-2005, 03:03 PM

[ QUOTE ]
If she had either
1. Busted Raymer with AJ vs. KK
2. Called with KJs against AA and doubled up against Shiek
3. Made the final table
4. No, she couldn't have won it all. Varkonyi and Furlong were much stronger players.

[/ QUOTE ]

Ya but did you see that article on Varkonyi that someone posted? I have to find it. He talks about how lucky he got and talks about hands on different days and his percentages of winning. I think every one he was behind. Day 1 I belive he was all in and caught a runner runner straight to stay alive.

sdplayerb · #3 11-03-2005, 03:19 PM

how about if she was good at all.
she is one of the worst players i've ever seen.
how could folding the KJ have taken that long? It was a two second decision at the longest.

#4 11-03-2005, 03:31 PM

The only reason to take any amount of time on that fold is to keep up the appearance that you are not raising with trash.

But, that was not her reason.

UATrewqaz · #5 11-03-2005, 03:57 PM

If she had won the whole thing it would have created two big notions

The first is good.

1. Anyone can win! (brings the fish in, continues the Moneymaker tradition)

The second is bad.

2. Poker is all luck and therefor just like casino gambling.

Everyone THINKS they are an expert player, even the fish deep down. Poker is special in the world becuase people think they can win (even people who play terribly).

Sykes · #6 11-03-2005, 07:17 PM

[ QUOTE ]
If she had won the whole thing it would have created two big notions

The first is good.

1. Anyone can win! (brings the fish in, continues the Moneymaker tradition)

The second is bad.

2. Poker is all luck and therefor just like casino gambling.

Everyone THINKS they are an expert player, even the fish deep down. Poker is special in the world becuase people think they can win (even people who play terribly).

[/ QUOTE ]

Anyone with half a brain can find out that #2 is not true.

I mean. If we had a final table of:

1. Tiffany
2. Raymer
3. Mike M.
4. Phil Ivey
5. John J.
And 4 other decent poker players

If Tiffany won, I'm sure there would be a lot more people also getting into the game but it would be foolish to say that poker is all luck.

Plus, to beat out 5600+ Players, you need a lot of luck plus a lot of skill. The only thing that changes is the factor of how good you are.

For example

If you're greg raymer or phil ivey, you need less luck than a complete amateur. But you still need luck, no matter how good you are. If no one needed luck, this wouldn't be called poker, it'd be called chess.

lozen · #7 11-03-2005, 08:22 PM

He to get through that many players Kudos to tiffany. Yes she was lucky on the hnads shown but thats what ESPN shows not the bland hands.

#8 11-03-2005, 10:44 PM

Does anyone realize that if she was a "better" player, she may not have made it nearly as deep? By sucking out, she was able to build her stack, whereas a better player may have waited for a premium hand, got it all in and had the hand cracked.

She had some luck (mandatory for anyone to get that far in the WSOP ME), she did her best, and she was respectful to the other players (no idiot celebrations, badmouthing, whatever). I say congratulations Tiffany, enjoy your winnings, and don't let anyone rip your achievement. 15th in the Main Event is something you can take pride in for the rest of your life!

#9 11-03-2005, 11:06 PM

I agree. She made it so far BECAUSE she was willing to gamble. More conservative players could never make it that far because they just ante themselves to death. Even if Tiffany did get her money in with the worst of it most of the time, at least she was giving herself the opportunities to build a monster stack. Not to mention with her off the wall, donkish aggression she probably picked up many undeserved pots from tighter opponents.

SoftcoreRevolt · #10 11-03-2005, 11:11 PM

Her play didn't seem very aggressive from the hands shown. She seemed to get it in with the worst hand on calls. Have they shown her reraising all in with something like KJ and being called by a dominating hand?