QQ 6 max

MrWookie47 · #1 05-06-2005, 07:27 PM

While it looks like the front page of the forum has more queens than a gay bar, I just ran into a QQ hand that confused me. This is also a 6 max hand, but I'm too much of a wimp to post it in HUSH, since they all play 5/10, 10/20, or 150/300.

I don't have much in the way of reads. MP in this hand I have at 30%/11%/1.5, putting him just slightly loose, and only marginally aggressive relative to typical 6 max players. He was showing down pretty typical 6 max fare, but since you can't see the results of mucked hands at Absolute, I didn't have much on his playing tendancies, which means I hadn't caught him bluffing much or making many glaring errors.

SB had sat down less than a dozen hands ago, so I've got less on him. He posted in MP, so he's probably a couple of donuts short of a dozen, but that's all I got.

Absolute Poker 1/2 Hold'em (6 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is Button with Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
1 fold, MP raises, 1 fold, Hero 3-bets, SB caps, 1 fold, MP calls, Hero calls.

Flop: (13 SB) J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (3 players)
SB checks, MP bets, Hero??

Raise? Call? Fold? I considered all three. SB checking after capping smelled funny, and MP betting into a preflop 3bettor doesn't help my stomach. Am I ahead of enough preflop raising AND capping hands to continue with this (taking into account the looser and more aggressive nature of 6 max), and if I do, should I take a stand raise, or just try and get to showdown cheaply?

Ianco15 · #2 05-06-2005, 07:37 PM

I would fold because of the preflop action. Feels like you're way behind too much on this flop to continue.

milesdyson · #3 05-06-2005, 07:38 PM

Yeah, fold. If you had the Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] IMO you could peel here.

Disconnected · #4 05-06-2005, 07:52 PM

Maybe this is a time where if you can't decide whether to call or fold, you should raise [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

MP's bet doesn't scare me whole lot, since there are a lot of PFR hands that you're ahead of. If SB capped with AA and it's 2 cold back to him, you might fold him.

If SB jumps in with a check-reraise, I would fold. If he smooth calls but MP raises, I would fold (this is the one I'm least sure of, but we'd be drawing slim, and to potentially tainted outs).

If SB folds, I would stick around even if MP raises, and play it WA/WB.

NateDog · #5 05-06-2005, 09:31 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Maybe this is a time where if you can't decide whether to call or fold, you should raise [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

MP's bet doesn't scare me whole lot, since there are a lot of PFR hands that you're ahead of. If SB capped with AA and it's 2 cold back to him, you might fold him.

If SB jumps in with a check-reraise, I would fold. If he smooth calls but MP raises, I would fold (this is the one I'm least sure of, but we'd be drawing slim, and to potentially tainted outs).

If SB folds, I would stick around even if MP raises, and play it WA/WB.

[/ QUOTE ]

MP raised initially, and couldn't 5bet it. What PF raising hands are we really that far ahead of? TT?

MrWookie47 · #6 05-06-2005, 09:49 PM

Most raising hands we're ahead of here (AJ, two hearts) have at least 5 outs against us.

aK13 · #7 05-06-2005, 08:40 PM

This one's definitely tough.

I definitely think calling is the worst choice, so it's between a raise and a fold. The more I think about it, the more I'd probably raise. Here's my reasoning.

Raise will give SB a chance to fold out of this pot, and I think he is the one you are most worried about (and would like to fold). However, given that he capped preflop and checked the flop, this play smells very much like some sort of slowplayed monster. I raise here, and this will probably be the last money I put in the pot (unless I get the odds to draw to my runner-runner straight/set). If you fold out SB, you can take the WA/WB line with MP2. If SB coldcalls or comes over the top, I'm done with the hand, as now I'm virtually certain he's got a monster (JJ or KK?) In conclusion, unlikely that SB will fold, but I'd contend 1 last time and then let it go. Probably not optimal, but realistically, it's hard to let go of QQ without a fight.

MrWookie47 · #8 05-06-2005, 10:44 PM

Well, I ended up folding. I figured that even with an expanded set of capping standards for SB, I was only ahead of AJs, AQs, TT and 99, but against an unknown, I couldn't include those for sure. Furthermore, if MP has the stones to bet that flop, he'd damn well better have a K. Your line of giving it one last hurrah is interesting. I'm not sure if I'll have the guts to do it next time, however. Are there any others who agree or disagree with this last hurrah play

I guess I'll post the results in white below:

 SB check/calls MP on the flop and turn. The river is checked through. Two bricks fell. SB reveals 99 for the win, MP mucks, and on Absolute, I can't see what he held. AhQh, maybe? I felt pretty dirty about the whole thing, folding the best hand for 1 bet in a large pot. I don't know if I'll be able to use this last hurrah play without thinking that I'm just fooling myself with results oriented thinking, but I don't know if I could just fold it again seeing these results. I did at least get some good notes on the villains. I still can't decide if I feel better about the whole thing knowing that some people agree that it was an OK fold.