2/4 Stud HI hand.

[gobboboy]

Hey all, I usually play stud recreationally (I'm ordering 7SFAP soon, probably too late for the reading but I figure I should actually figure out what I'm doing) but one of the problems I have is identifying when my opponents are just maniacs or whether or not they have the goods. Here's my first 7stud hand on 2+2, and hopefully it won't be my last.

7 Card Stud High ($2/$4), Ante $0.25, Bring-In $1 (converter)

Seat 1: $36.50
Seat 2: $42.50
Seat 3: $200
Seat 6: $89.50
Hero: $328.75
Seat 8: $131.50

3rd Street - (0.75 SB)

Seat 1: xx xx J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]___calls___calls
Seat 2: xx xx Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___raises
Seat 3: xx xx T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___calls
Seat 6: xx xx T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___folds
Hero: 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]___calls
Seat 8: xx xx 4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]___brings-in___calls

4th Street - (5.75 SB)

Seat 1: xx xx J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___checks___raises___calls
Seat 2: xx xx Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___checks___calls___calls
Seat 3: xx xx T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___bets___calls___calls
Hero: 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]___raises___raises
Seat 8: xx xx 4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]___calls___calls

5th Street - (12.88 BB)

Seat 1: xx xx J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___bets___raises___calls
Seat 2: xx xx Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___calls___calls___calls
Seat 3: xx xx T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___folds
Hero: 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___raises___raises
Seat 8: xx xx 4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]___checks___calls___calls

6th Street - (28.88 BB)

Seat 1: xx xx J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]___bets___raises $2.25 to $10.25 and is all-in
Seat 2: xx xx Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]___calls___calls___calls
Hero: 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]___raises___raises
Seat 8: xx xx 4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___checks___calls___calls

River - (40.44 BB)

Seat 1: xx xx J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] xx___all-in
Seat 2: xx xx Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] xx___checks___folds
Hero: 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___bets___calls
Seat 8: xx xx 4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] xx___checks___raises

Total pot: (44.44 BB)

Comments on all streets are appreciated. Don't assume I know standard things, because I likely don't. When I first started playing stud I used what they said on Rounders, and I doubt that's the best advice. [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

Personally, I fold third facing a raise. You have only undercards, with probably two Queens out (since the raise implies QQ), dead J and Ts. You caught perfect cards on 4th (I still wouldn't raise here) and 5th, and I think you're right to pound it from then on.

As late as sixth street you have a board lock over everyone but seat 8, and he needs 77, 74 or J7 pocket cards precisely to have you beat. Rolled 4s impossible, pocket JJ impossible. He didn't raise until the river, so if he's got quads or a full house, he sure played this passively.

[highlife]

[ QUOTE ]
Personally, I fold third facing a raise. You have only undercards, with probably two Queens out (since the raise implies QQ), dead J and Ts. You caught perfect cards on 4th (I still wouldn't raise here) and 5th, and I think you're right to pound it from then on.

As late as sixth street you have a board lock over everyone but seat 8, and he needs 77, 74 or J7 pocket cards precisely to have you beat. Rolled 4s impossible, pocket JJ impossible. He didn't raise until the river, so if he's got quads or a full house, he sure played this passively.

[/ QUOTE ]

i agree with everything he said here, its spot on.

your cards are dead on 3rd, even a limp is incorrect.

[preiserone]

[ QUOTE ]
your cards are dead on 3rd, even a limp is incorrect.

[/ QUOTE ]

I dont think a call on 3rd is wrong given, i assume from this hand, the implied odds hes getting to hit 4th street. If its wrong its not by much.

Other than that I just call on 4th probably, it doesn't look like anyone is folding so wait until you hit your hand then punish them, it is a pretty weak draw.

[highlife]

i dont like 1/2 dead 3 straights with no good pair outs, even with 5 way action.

[preiserone]

[ QUOTE ]
i dont like 1/2 dead 3 straights with no good pair outs, even with 5 way action.

[/ QUOTE ]

Agreed. I'm not saying a fold is bad. just that a call could be marginally justified at a good table where you know you will get action if you make your hand.

[highlife]

[ QUOTE ]


Agreed. I'm not saying a fold is bad. just that a call could be marginally justified at a good table where you know you will get action if you make your hand.

[/ QUOTE ]

okay cool, i see where you are coming from. i might even need to widen my range for situations alot like this.

[Andy B]

Either you were doing really well in this game or you subscribe to the same buy-in theory as Carlos.

I don't think the third-street call is awful, but as others have pointed out, folding is probably better. There are probably two Queens gone, as well as the Jack, and having a couple of Tens gone doesn't help your cause, either.

I would just call on fourth. A couple of your straight cards are gone. Your raise should tend to knock people out when you'd probably be best served by keeping them in. That said, you did succeed in getting everyone to call a cap. Even with a couple of your cards gone, you probably have enough equity to make this worthwhile. You were in this game and we weren't. If you were thinking, "I can probably get a five-way cap here," then more power to you.

I gleefully cap fifth and sixth as well. If seat 8 is the tricky sort who might just call along with a full house, you have to exercise some caution. Definitely bet the river, but when the other guy raises, you can only call.

[gobboboy]

I don't even know what the proper stud buyin is. [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img] Told you, I really don't know what I'm doing. I just win more money at stud than holdem recently.