#1
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5 hands - Common WTSD% Theme
Here are five hands from my session tonight. I do not like posts with lots of hands in them but these five all have a common theme and they relate to my other current post relating to WTSD%. I am trying to look for spots where I might change my default play to enable me to get to showdowns instead of folding earlier. This is an experiment and these hands are spots that I might have played differently a few days ago. Sorry about having so many hands grouped together, but I don’t think they are different and they have similar themes.
Hand 1 (10 handed): Villain in this hand is 11.8/6.85/2.23/336 (VPIP/PFR/AF/Hands). Although these number were on my screen I did not look at them during this hand and thus I assumed my opponent was just a typical party over-aggressive player. I include the stats for the sake of completeness. Preflop: Hero is BB with 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]. <font color="#666666">MP1 calls, <font color="#CC3333">MP3 raises</font>, Hero calls, MP1 calls. Flop: (6.66 SB) 2[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font> <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, MP1 folds, <font color="#CC3333">MP3 raises</font>, Hero calls. Turn: (5.33 BB) T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font> Hero checks, <font color="#CC3333">MP3 bets</font>, Hero calls. River: (7.33 BB) 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font> Hero checks, <font color="#CC3333">MP3 bets</font>, Hero calls. Final Pot: 9.33 BB [/ QUOTE ] Hand 2 (7 handed): Villian in this hand was 19.8/15.44/1.36/298. Preflop: Hero is Button with J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]. <font color="#CC3333">CO raises</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero 3-bets</font>, CO calls. Flop: (7.66 SB) 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font> CO checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, CO calls. Turn: (4.83 BB) K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font> CO checks, Hero checks. River: (4.83 BB) 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font> CO checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, CO folds. Final Pot: 5.83 BB [/ QUOTE ] Hand 3 (10 handed): Villian is the same as in previous hand. Preflop: Hero is MP3 with J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]. <font color="#CC3333">UTG+2 raises</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero 3-bets</font>, UTG+2 calls. Flop: (7.66 SB) 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font> UTG+2 checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, UTG+2 calls. Turn: (4.83 BB) 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font> UTG+2 checks, Hero checks. River: (4.83 BB) 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font> <font color="#CC3333">UTG+2 bets</font>, Hero calls. Final Pot: 6.83 BB [/ QUOTE ] Hand 4 (9 handed): Villian is 16.8/12.28/2.11/969 with an Attempt to Steal 25.86 (this stat must take a while to converge though). Preflop: Hero is BB with Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]. <font color="#CC3333">Button raises</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero 3-bets</font>, Button calls. Flop: (6.66 SB) K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font> <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Button raises</font>, Hero calls. Turn: (5.33 BB) 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font> Hero checks, Button checks. River: (5.33 BB) 4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font> Hero checks, Button checks. Final Pot: 5.33 BB [/ QUOTE ] Hand 5 (8 handed): Villian in this hand is 8.5/2.13/0.00/47 – meaningless really, but chances are he is tighter than your normal 15/30 donk. Preflop: Hero is CO with A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]. <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, BB calls. Flop: (4.66 SB) 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font> BB checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, BB calls. Turn: (3.33 BB) Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font> BB checks, Hero checks. River: (3.33 BB) A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font> BB checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, BB calls. Final Pot: 5.33 BB All comments welcome and appreciated. |
#2
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Re: 5 hands - Common WTSD% Theme
1: Dubious call down against this type of player. He probably does not expect you to fold R, in which case you are beat.
2: Bet turn and call a raise. Best 2nd pair is a strong holding in the steal zone. 3: Bet turn and fold to a raise. Why give a free card? 4: Bet river. 5:Bet turn and call a raise. Your 3BB loss where he has a J will be easily outweighed by the times he pays you off with a worse hand - or bluffs. I like the check behind on the turn with a goodish hand, sometimes, but not on these ones. Just a few thoughts .... |
#3
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Re: 5 hands - Common WTSD% Theme
[ QUOTE ]
1: Dubious call down against this type of player. He probably does not expect you to fold R, in which case you are beat. 2: Bet turn and call a raise. Best 2nd pair is a strong holding in the steal zone. 3: Bet turn and fold to a raise. Why give a free card? 4: Bet river. 5:Bet turn and call a raise. Your 3BB loss where he has a J will be easily outweighed by the times he pays you off with a worse hand - or bluffs. I like the check behind on the turn with a goodish hand, sometimes, but not on these ones. Just a few thoughts .... [/ QUOTE ] This is just about what I would typically do. 1. Remember, I didn't know these stats at the time and the WTSD thread is very much on my mind atm. I'm trying to figure out where people are going to showdown that I am not. 2. If he has a king and I bet the turn and call him down after he raises (and he will almost always raise the turn with a king) I am getting outplayed. If I check and call there are only 6 cards that I am afraid of (that might not even be a problem if he has undercards) whereas I may induce him to bet a lot of worse hands than mine (88, etc.) I'm really not sure this hand is a simple turn bet - that is what I have been doing in the past though so /shrug. I post because I am unsure. 3: Bet turn and fold to a raise. Why give a free card? This is horrible. You realize I have a gutshot on the turn now right? If I get check raised here I can't fold so getting check raised is very expensive. I actually think this is a good turn check. I may get a bet out of hands that would have folded if I had bet, I get a cheap chance to improve if I am currently behind and if I am ahead my opponent can't have "that" many outs. I think it's close between betting and checking behind, but betting and folding is certainly wrong. If I bet I am forced to call a check raise and then I probably fold the river. I think I already fold the river too much and don't showdown enough. Checking behind here fixes all of those issues. 4. I was going to bet any non-club. His hand looks too much like a flush draw and the pot is small so I won't get a lot of lose calls. I do think it's close and I usually bet here. I was trying to induce a bluff. 5:Bet turn and call a raise. Your 3BB loss where he has a J will be easily outweighed by the times he pays you off with a worse hand - or bluffs. I disagree with this and think this may be a good spot for me to be checking behind. I posted because I'm not sure obviously. |
#4
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Re: 5 hands - Common WTSD% Theme
Hand 1 I fold preflop to that player. Jsut becasue you are in a tough spot out of poisition. If it were heads up I might like the play more - but just not a great spot. I think I check fold the flop.
Hand 2 you have to bet the turn. Don't want to give a free card there. No reason to think he has a K. Hand 3 - eww, this is not a good trend. You can't be giving free cards here. Make this play with AQ here not JJ. Hand 4 is fine. Hand 5: eww again this is bad. Bet turn. People are not getting to higher s.d. numbers by playing scared. You make these turn checks when you have Ace high. |
#5
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Re: 5 hands - Common WTSD% Theme
I think that the attempts to get to showdown cheaply were misguided in all 5 hands.
Check/raise the flop in hand 1. I'd fold the river in 1 even against party 15 typicals. Bet the turn in hand 2,3 and 5. In hand 4, I'd bet-fold the river. More likely he has a lower pocket pair than a flush. |
#6
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Re: 5 hands - Common WTSD% Theme
Thanks for the check up boys. I like Jeff's terminology here - the plays were misguided. None of them would be standard plays for me and I guess they are all wrong. I will have to revert back to my normal game and look for other possible spots that I am not getting to showdown when I should.
I appreciate the slap in the face. It's why I posted. |
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