News: Gutshot in the UK - can this help NYC players?

[Luv2DriveTT]

Chips are down as poker clubs await court ruling
By Howard Swains and Adam Fresco
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A LANDMARK ruling on whether poker is a game of skill or merely luck will decide the future of the growing number of gaming clubs across the country.
If poker is deemed to be one of skill, as are chess and bridge, it can remain available to players in members’ clubs. But if it is seen as one of chance, as are roulette and blackjack, it will legally be played only in licensed casinos. A year-long investigation into Gutshot, a prominent London club, by the Gambling Commission and the Metropolitan Police’s clubs and vice unit, has resulted in two charges relating to breaches of the 1968 Gaming Act, including taking a levy from the stakes or winnings of players.



Derek Kelly, the owner of the Gutshot club, which claims to have 12,000 members, admits hosting poker games since January 2004. But he argues that the tournaments are merely the activities of a private club whose members engage in a game of skill. Highbury Corner magistrates are this week looking at the strict regulations that govern the organisation of poker games in clubs and casinos.

Mr Kelly argues that as a non-profit-making members’ club, Gutshot is simply providing a service to its members and that any money made is returned to the committee, which, in turn, gives it to the members at its discretion. He also believes that poker is a game of skill, where a talented player can overcome the luck element inherent in the majority of card games.

Poker players employ sophisticated strategy, including bluffing and the reading of other players. “Poker is a game dominated by skill,” Mr Kelly said. “Provided you are more able, ultimately you will be the winner. Like any game or sport, there are elements of luck. However, the more skilful player will win out in the end.”

Darren Warner, of the clubs and vice unit, explained the reason for the prosecution. “There seems to be a prima facia case of breaches of the Gaming Act, but there’s no test case,” he said. “The Gaming Act is a book as wide as Wales but there are a couple of specific offences. It’s a very unusual police case in that the defendants and the police are saying exactly the same thing is happening. We’re saying ‘You did this,’ and they’re saying ‘Yes we did. But we don’t think we’re doing anything wrong’.”

Several other poker clubs have opened across the country in the 19 months since Gutshot’s inception. A ruling against Mr Kelly would enable the police swiftly to close down premises advertised as card clubs. If Mr Kelly wins it would pave the way for properly constituted poker rooms to open wherever suitable premises can be found.

LEARN THE RULES IN HOURS - SPEND A LIFETIME MASTERING IT

IT TAKES only a couple of hours to learn the most popular versions of poker — once you know the value of each hand, there’s not much more to it. It’s then a question of experience and learning to read body language. Is poker a game of chance? I’d say that it’s 80 per cent skill, and the rest is luck. The existence of professional players proves that chance is not the determining factor.
By Tony Cascarino, Gambling Commentator

POKER is a game that you can learn in hours, but it takes a lifetime to master. Professional players say that playing a novice is hard, as they are as likely to bet all their money with a terrible 7, 2 as a great pair of aces. My first live tournament was in Las Vegas in July. I chucked every chip in with J,9 (not a great hand). When the dealer turned over three more nines to give me a brilliant hand, I could only give an embarrassed smile.
By Adam Fresco

[TStoneMBD]

i really cant understand this country. poker is obviously a game of skill. anyone without a gambling addiction could understand that. politics are a weapon.

[JFB37]

The short answer to your question is no. The ruling will have no effect and be of virtually zero precedential value in NY. I wish, though.

btw . . . I've been to the Gutshot. It makes some of the NY clubs look like palaces. Well, maybe not the Diamond Club.

Interesting how two different countries law enforcement agencies operate. They research the law and determine if there is a law being broken, NYPD comes in with guns blazing and sorts it out later.

Unfortunately here nobody has really tested the law.