Limit Omaha HL8: Starting hands at a midsized loose table

[Borodog]

Greetings. I have a question about starting hands in limit Omaha hi-lo 8 or better. I run a weekly home game that sees about 80% of the hands dealt O8. The table is usually 5-6 handed, although 8 handed is not unheard of. I am by far the tightest player pre-flop. Other than myself, usually everyone sees the flop; there is rarely a pre-flop raise, and pre-flop raisers can reliably be put on quality A2 hands (except one guy who seems to incorrectly raise pre-flop with all high hands). There is little raising for position, because the only person who folds pre-flop for a raise is me; and I was probably going to fold anyway. [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

It's difficult to tell because of the other games that get dealt in the mix, but I believe I average between 2-3 big bets/hour (based on about 50 sessions) at O8.

Here is the problem: I know that as the number of players goes down, starting hand value goes up. A five-handed O8 table sees many more non-nut winners than does a ten-handed table. Also, the looseness and passivity of the table usually means that I am getting relatively high implied odds before the flop. Both of these would seem to indicate (along with table image considerations; i.e. I want action when I hit) that I should loosen my starting requirements. But how loose is too loose?

This past Friday night I was up big (3 full buy-ins) and loosened up what I considered to be just a bit. The results were a rapid succession of second best hands, uncomfortable laydowns of what turned out to be mediocre winners, and going broke faster than I could believe it. Some of this may have been poor cards, but I believe the majority of it was putting myself in the middle in the first place.

So what are the loosest starting hands you would play under such circumstances? 5-6 handed, usually everyone else calling, pre-flop raises rare?

Thanks ahead of time for your thoughts.

Michael Owen

[Buzz]

Michael - What is your betting structure? Is there a lot of pre-flop raising? Do you only play Omaha-8, or are there other games that are played, perhaps dealer's choice? If other games are also played, what are they, and how often is Omaha-8 called?

What are the opinions of your opponents about what constitutes a good Omaha-8 hand (1) to start, (2) after the flop, (3) after the turn, and (4) on the river? Do they recognize situations where you need the nuts as opposed to situations where less than the nuts might do?

Are your opponents loose in terms of seeing the flop and then tigher in terms of continuing after the flop - or are they loose and then chasers? Do they try to bluff too much, or not enough? Do they shy away without the nuts when you bet, or do they hang in there?

Can you generally put them on cards by the time you get to the river?

How loosely you can play depends on your answers to these and other questions, in my humble opinion.

That written, when playing in a casino, I tend to not ease up much in terms of starting hand standards when the table becomes short handed.

In a loose, passive, low stakes home game where everybody sees the flop and raises before the flop are rare, and where the betting limits are higher on later betting rounds, and where my opponents do not seem to recognize many of the finer points of the game of Omaha-8, and where it's often easy for me to sense what they are holding, I'll generally see eighty per cent of the flops myself.

Just my opinion.

Buzz