River call decision with overpair.

[EVIL]

Game is Party $25 NL (0.25/0.50).

Hero is dealt T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] in EP3 at full table. His stack is $67.

Everyone limps in except for MP2, CO, Button, and SB, who fold. BB checks.

Pot: $3.25

6 see the flop of

8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

Hero has all 5 opponents covered.
Checked to hero who bets $3. MP3 ($32) and UTG ($43) call.

Pot: $12.25

Turn: 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]

UTG and Hero check to MP3 who bets $0.50. Both call.

Pot: $13.75

River: 6[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

UTG bets $10.

[Krytemaster]

Be glad if you have the best hand here one every twenty hands...

Fold!!

[RollaJ]

I'd say you have the best hand here about one in 10 times, that being said you have to call 10 to win 23 1:2.3 no good. fold it.

[EVIL]

The combination of there being so many ways in which I could be beat, and the fact that there was still one player left to act behind, led me to fold.

Results:

MP3 calls.

UTG turns over K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]
MP3 turns over 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]

[X-Calibre]

Does anybody else think this play was particulary passive?

On the flop i dont think anyone has a made straight, but it's entirely reasonable that someone is now open ended (any 6 and 2 diamonds) Based on that you would be better off making a more than potsized bet to make calling with a draw a TOP mistake.

By the time the river comes the fold is prob correct, specially if you feel these opponents would pay 3 on the flop to ride out the gutshot. However, i'm not as afraid of a 6 as i would be of either a 9,4, or diamond.

[Daithi]

This is a great example of a typical NL hand. For what it is worth here is some of my thought process into how I would play this hand, and the decisions I would make in our hero’s place.

UTG and UTG+1 both limp in and our hero looks down to find T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]. What to do? Our hero can limp in here hoping to hit a set, or he can put in a raise to try and limit the field a bit. A problem with raising here is that he could get reraised and would be looking at either an overpair in which case he is a big dog, or two big overcards in which case it is a coin flip. There is another problem in raising with TT. What happens when you get a caller or two or three and the flop comes with over cards to your TT? I think hands like TT or 99 or even JJ can be hard to play especially if you are out of position.

Even with all the dangers a raise with TT entails I would still raise here. Aggression plays a huge roll in No Limit Holdem, and I find playing against one or two opponents a lot easier than playing against a whole field of opponents.

So now we get our flop of 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]. What to do? In the example our hero provided there was not a lot of money in the pot, and I’ve never been a fan of getting myself broke on a pot that has no money in it. This is another reason I like to raise when I play a hand. I want money in the pot to make taking a risk worthwhile. Had our hero raised before the flop this hand would be easier to play. Let’s say he raised to $2 before the flop (I try to raise an amount that will get people to fold but not commit a lot of my stack – this amount can be table dependent). If he only got one or two callers he can now make a pot sized bet, or in this case I’d make a bit more than a pot sized bet. There is a flush draw and a possible straight on the board, and an overcard can kill you. A pre-flop raise to $2 with two callers would have around $6 or $7 in the pot, so I’d make a $10 bet at this pot. If someone comes back over the top I would have to make a determination. Is he coming over the top because he thinks I’m full of it? Is he coming over the top because he has a better overpair or a set? Does he have the straight? This is what makes poker fun.

In our hero’s case he had 6 people in a pot with no money in it. If I was in his place at this moment I’d probably play exactly as he did – a pot sized bet that I hope takes it.

Now we are at the turn with a board of
8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].

Had we raised preflop, and made a big bet after the flop we might be in trouble here. What on earth could we be getting called by? A flush draw is a possibility but a big bet on the flop puts the caller on notice that it is very likely he will be playing for all his chips on the next hand. He didn’t have the right odds to call that big bet but people do anyway. A few other possible holdings are a set, two pair, the straight, a bigger overpair, the 6[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] and another [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], or a suited ace with the kicker pairing the board. Or he thought you were full of it on the pre-flop bet, he holds 2 overcards and is waiting to see if you will fire a second bet. What to do in this case gets real tough, and becomes very player dependent as well as stack size dependent.

In the case of our hero I’d have to put the other two players on a draw. I’d definitely not check here. I’d make a pot sized bet (maybe bigger than pot sized). However, our hero checked only to see a post oak bluff made at the pot. At this point I’d really have to think my hand is best and would make a good sized bet to clarify things. If the teeny raiser moved all-in or I get called I’d rethink my strategy.

On the river we have a board of
8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
Someone could easily have been playing 9T, A9, or A4. I’d check and fold at this point.

Anyway, that is how my thought process works, and some of the tactics I employ. I hope this posting was of help to someone out there.

David

[EVIL]

Thanks for the reply Daithi. I think you're right in that I should at least occasionally raise with a medium pair like TT in that position, for various reasons. My strategy has been to limp pretty much every time since in that game, Party $25 NL, generally a conservative strategy seems to work pretty well.

I also think I should've bet the turn, since even though the 8 made me a little nervous, it very well may have made them nervous, too. I made a mistake by not check-raising once the LP player made the tiny bet of $0.50.

[EVIL]