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#1
11-04-2005, 12:01 PM
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Q2s in BB against a raise (4/8 live)
Table know's I play a solid TAG style. I've been playing with these same guys for 5+ hrs + I've played with most of them before, so I have a good handle on how each of them plays.
4 any-two-will-do limpers call, CO (loose but particularily good postflop player) calls, button raises (basically a loose/passive; his range here is QQ+,AK,maybe AJs+; but CO doesn't know this) I call from BB Q2s. Flop: Q22 (two hearts) I bet, CO raises, button 3 bets, I call, CO calls. turn is a brick; I bet and both call. River is a brick; I bet button calls. Did I miss any bets here? Is this pf call ok? What other trash (that I wouldn't play on the button for one bet)should I be calling with here? I really wonder if I play too tight from the blinds in games like this. I mean after bunch of players who literally play any two cards and are brutal post flop, limp, isn't something like A8o, K9o, 86o, etc, worth seeing the flop for half price in the SB? 
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#2
11-04-2005, 12:15 PM
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Re: Q2s in BB against a raise (4/8 live)
[ QUOTE ]
Did I miss any bets here? Is this pf call ok? What other trash (that I wouldn't play on the button for one bet)should I be calling with here? [/ QUOTE ] Nice attempt at camouflage, but lookit-my-BB-trash-flops-a-boat hands should go in the NC thread. But, to answer your questions: This preflop call sucks. A top-notch postflop player has limped with excellent position on you, and a passive has raised. Postflop, what possible purpose could be served by only calling the flop 3-bet and then donkbetting the turn? Either cap the flop/lead the turn, or call the flop/check-raise the turn.
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#3
11-04-2005, 12:17 PM
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Re: Q2s in BB against a raise (4/8 live)
I would play it exactly the same.
Margon
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#4
11-04-2005, 12:25 PM
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Re: Q2s in BB against a raise (4/8 live)
[ QUOTE ]
This preflop call sucks. A top-notch postflop player has limped with excellent position on you, and a passive has raised. [/ QUOTE ] Booo...This pot is already big, youre already in for 1 sb, if you're folding any two suited cards here I think youre making a mistake
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#5
11-04-2005, 12:41 PM
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Re: Q2s in BB against a raise (4/8 live)
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] This preflop call sucks. A top-notch postflop player has limped with excellent position on you, and a passive has raised. [/ QUOTE ] Booo...This pot is already big, youre already in for 1 sb, if you're folding any two suited cards here I think youre making a mistake [/ QUOTE ] Meh. When it's 3 or 4 LPs limping to you in the small blind that's one thing. When you mix in a good-postflop limper, that makes it something else. When a passive raises after both of these events, I think you have to look past the complete-with-any-two-suited rule. Even the SSH preflop chart says fold XXs in the BB in a raised pot. [img]/images/graemlins/cool.gif[/img]
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#6
11-04-2005, 01:00 PM
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Re: Q2s in BB against a raise (4/8 live)
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] This preflop call sucks. A top-notch postflop player has limped with excellent position on you, and a passive has raised. [/ QUOTE ] Booo...This pot is already big, youre already in for 1 sb, if you're folding any two suited cards here I think youre making a mistake [/ QUOTE ] Meh. When it's 3 or 4 LPs limping to you in the small blind that's one thing. When you mix in a good-postflop limper, that makes it something else. When a passive raises after both of these events, I think you have to look past the complete-with-any-two-suited rule. Even the SSH preflop chart says fold XXs in the BB in a raised pot. [img]/images/graemlins/cool.gif[/img] [/ QUOTE ] I tend to agree with Boz, here, but I guess it depends on your postflop abilities. If the flop comes QJ7 with none or one of your suit, how well are you going to do?
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#7
11-04-2005, 01:04 PM
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Re: Q2s in BB against a raise (4/8 live)
I dont know why youre so caught up on this "Top-Notch" postflop player. Does his presence affect the poor play of the 4 limpers in between us? I'd be more concerned with the passive player raisiing. And this isnt, and shouldnt be classified as XXs; Your hand actually has "some" hi-card value. I can understand not wanting to call w/ 72s,82,92s, and so on, but you gotsta call with a suited Q here.
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#8
11-04-2005, 01:04 PM
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Re: Q2s in BB against a raise (4/8 live)
If CO's range is this small I'm folding here pf. I would normally fold pf with Qxs anyway but all your any 2 will do guys limping may make it close. However, it sounds like your going to be a big dog out of position in this hand to button and a good CO player.
I think post flop is fine. I thought that maybe a check/raise on the turn would be good but I think it's better to bet and hope button raises so you could cap.
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#9
11-04-2005, 01:07 PM
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Re: Q2s in BB against a raise (4/8 live)
Are you folding AXs? What if the flop comes AT4...
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#10
11-04-2005, 01:18 PM
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Re: Q2s in BB against a raise (4/8 live)
[ QUOTE ]
Are you folding AXs? What if the flop comes AT4... [/ QUOTE ] No. But, of course, a queen isn't an ace. What if the flop comes Qxx, one spade, two hearts, CO opens and Button calls? And, with reference to your earlier post, I am much more worried about the passive raiser than the postflop-good CO. The only concern about the CO for me is that he limped...that says to me that he's either got a real trash hand that he's going to fold pretty quickly (reducing our implieds, obviously) or a real strong hand that he's trying to trap with. Anything middlin' (AT, KJ, etc) I'd expect him to raise to try and buy the button and thin the field.
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