Owned by a LAG?

hobbsmann · #1 10-06-2005, 11:20 AM

SB has shown qualities of being a LAGtard through 50 hands. He will routinely bluff any scare card and just seems to play erratic in general. 50/30/2.5 type.

Party 5/10 (6max, 6 handed)

(don't have the HH at work)

I open in the CO with QJo (no hearts), SB calls, BB calss

Flop (6 sb): K [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]J [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]3 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]
check, check, I bet, SB raises, BB folds, I call

Turn (5 bb): 7 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]
SB checks, I bet (?), SB raises, I call (?)

River (9 bb): J [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]
SB bets, I raise, sb 3-bets, I call

Flame away.

DrSavage · #2 10-06-2005, 11:25 AM

Seems about right.

Wynton · #3 10-06-2005, 11:30 AM

I don't think your line is bad at all.

But I'll just make a general comment. Against a real LAGtard, I've been experimenting with going to war on the flop more, on the theory that you can extract the most at that stage. I don't know whether this is the best flop to take such an approach, though.

SparkyDog · #4 10-06-2005, 12:05 PM

I'd check behind on the turn, but the coordinated board makes it closer. If it weren't for all the draws, I think the turn would be a clear check.

kiddo · #5 10-06-2005, 12:32 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Against a real LAGtard, I've been experimenting with going to war on the flop more, on the theory that you can extract the most at that stage. I don't know whether this is the best flop to take such an approach, though.

[/ QUOTE ]

Why not? There are both straight and flushdraws out there so LAG will mostly not have toppair when he checkraises.

I like the line our Hero took, but 3betting flop is also fine. Bad thing about 3betting flop is of course that LAG will checkraise turn with toppair and we have to call him down.

Another poster said: "Check turn". Against a 50/30/2.5 that is a big misstake. 2nd pair is huge, even if flop was without draws.

Wynton · #6 10-06-2005, 01:01 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Against a real LAGtard, I've been experimenting with going to war on the flop more, on the theory that you can extract the most at that stage. I don't know whether this is the best flop to take such an approach, though.

[/ QUOTE ]

Why not? There are both straight and flushdraws out there so LAG will mostly not have toppair when he checkraises.

[/ QUOTE ]

I dunno. Maybe this is a good flop to be aggressive. I'm just not sure of myself yet, because I've only recently started experimenting with this approach, which is why I bothered mentioning it.

purnell · #7 10-06-2005, 01:30 PM

I like your line. His stats say maniac, and he is in a blind. Sometimes you lose, but you're good here alot. I suppose he showed you 33? [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]

SparkyDog · #8 10-06-2005, 02:06 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Another poster said: "Check turn". Against a 50/30/2.5 that is a big misstake. 2nd pair is huge, even if flop was without draws.

[/ QUOTE ]

Why? I can't make heads or tails of his actions, as the iso-checkraise then turn check makes absolutely no sense. When I can't tell what an aggressive loose player has I like getting to showdown, cheaply with a weak hand like this one.

I've got an inclination to think that he's either got a really strong draw (and there's a strong possibility of bluffing the river if he misses) or if he's got a made hand it has our ass kicked, and will end up putting in 3 BB's on the turn and river if we bet the turn.

50/30/2.5 doesn't mean much to me though, so we may be thinking of different types of players...

paco · #9 10-06-2005, 02:43 PM

[quote
Why? I can't make heads or tails of his actions, as the iso-checkraise then turn check makes absolutely no sense. When I can't tell what an aggressive loose player has I like getting to showdown, cheaply with a weak hand like this one.

[/ QUOTE ]

Agreed. This type of player to me always seems to follow through on the turn with his semi-bluff (as he should). I think a reverse free card play is not what's going on here--the check is very suspicious, and with only second pair I want to show this down. Take the free card and PRESTO, the free card made your hand. Of course raise a bet and yes call a 3-bet.

hobbsmann · #10 10-06-2005, 03:13 PM

The difficult thing about this situation for me is that this guys falls on the border of ordinary LAG and maniac and thus understanding when and where to extract max value becomes hard. For example against a maniac any pair has a ton of value and jamming the flop and making sure bets get put in on every street becomes important. As these players become saner you start to respect their bets a little more where a c/r on two subsequent streets usually means business and a fold might be in order.

The guy in this hand was borderline IMO and thus took me out of my comfort zone in terms of controlling the amount of money I committed to this pot with a marginal hand. The reason I wanted to post this hand was because while I felt every place I put bets in against this guy was appropriate I definitely felt uncomfortable in spots.