Extracting Value w/ a Big Hand

98romaine · #1 10-03-2005, 11:16 PM

Looking for some different ideas on playing this hand on the turn. I made a weak continuation bet on the flop, not sure if it was too weak or not. I was hoping for a bigger bet from villian on turn. Do you c/r all in? smoothcall and lead river?

Thanks for replies.

Party $2-4 NL Full ring

Hero $360
Villian $242

No read on villian, been at the table only for about 20 min. He limps UTG, SB completes, I raise it to $15.

Party Poker (8 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is BB with K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
6 folds.

Flop: J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players)
.
Hero bets $8
Villian calls $8
Turn: 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero checks.
Villian bets $20

RED FACE · #2 10-04-2005, 12:25 AM

I don't play this high.

Only hands I can put him on are,
AJs not likely to call the pref r
JJ not likely
AA seriously slowplayed
some other pp
AK

If he has a strong J and you push he could put you on a semi bluff and you take his stack(tho not likely) otherwise I think he will fold any weaker hand if you raise here so I'd wait for the river and just push it. I think there's a good enough chance that he would call the push with any hand that he would call a mere value bet with. If you check the river(I know you weren't asking about river play) he wont push trip J's and will fold to a raise so I push river.

#3 10-04-2005, 01:40 AM

To me I think the villian probably has 1 of 3 things, J/As, A/K, or AA.

A/Js- I don't play 2-4 and never have so I'm not too sure on the hand selection but I think it could be reasonable to assume a loose new player could call with A/Js and try to string you along with what he thinks is the best hand.

A/K-This is most likely to call the preflop. A/K would easily call the weak flop bet IMO and put out a feeler bet on the turn, which I believe is what the villian did. I think that this is what the villian probably has and is trying to see if you have him beat. I believe that if you call he will be more wary on the river and will probably fold to a large bet, suspecting a trap. I think you should probably raise him on the turn, maybe not all in but definitely a medium-sized raise, maybe to 60-80. If he calls he has commited a large chunk of money to the pot and will probably make a call to a bet on the river.

AA- Unlikely, but if they're slowing playing this they probably think they have the best hand and you could probably push in on the turn.

PoBoy321 · #4 10-04-2005, 01:45 AM

Bet more like $25 on the flop or whatever your standard continuation bet would be.

kitaristi0 · #5 10-04-2005, 02:12 AM

I bet more on the flop, and then c/r the turn.

Allinlife · #6 10-04-2005, 02:19 AM

cr= i scare you

keep betting sir

amoeba · #7 10-04-2005, 02:23 AM

my standard line here is 2/3 pot, 2/3 pot, 1/2 pot.

J will raise me somewhere along the way. K will be enticed to call down.

QT will call the flop, maybe call the turn if they are loose.

kitaristi0 · #8 10-04-2005, 07:21 AM

Actually, now that I think about it, c/r is not good at all in this spot.

When he calls the flop he has either a jack, king, AA or QT. C/R will scare away QT, AA and probably even a K. If he has a J you're getting his money.

However, if you bet say 2/3 pot, he calls with a K, maybe AA, maybe QT. Again if he has a J you're getting his money, so it seems betting out is the best play.

Inducing a bluff has no value here since it's highly unlikely he called on the flop just to bluff you out on the turn.

98romaine · #9 10-04-2005, 07:58 AM

Thanks for the responses...I ended up checkraising the turn to $60 which he called. I'm pretty sure he has J-x at this point, so I pushed the river and he folded.

C/R was probably the worst/most obvious way to play this, it was pretty obvious I had a huge hand and probably will not get paid by a strong J. On the other hand it is Party, and I have seen stranger hands when people stack off.

I think best line was 2/3 pot, 2/3 pot, 1/2pot and I get paid the whole way.

Hattifnatt · #10 10-04-2005, 08:30 AM

I bet something like between 80% to full pot on the flop. Same at the turn. With that line Villian is getting a hard time getting away if he has a Jack.

A weak bet on the flop and c/r on the turn smells huge strength and he can get away from JT pretty easy if he's not an idiot.