PL and NL by Ciaffone -Comments?

BillsChips · #1 09-30-2005, 11:45 AM

I just picked up the Pot Limit and No Limit book by Ciaffone, based on recommendations from 2+2 members. This is my 10th poker book and I find it to be the worst written book I've seen. I'm not specifically talking about the advice, although I have some reservations about that, but many of his stories are hard to understand and seem to be pointless. I'm about 2/3 through the book and I'll probably finish it, but I also bought HOH V1 and I'm anxious to start it.

Am I missing something, or is the Ciaffone book grossly overrated?

Rudbaeck · #2 09-30-2005, 12:56 PM

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Am I missing something, or is the Ciaffone book grossly overrated?

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You're missing something. 2+2 books should by now have inoculated you against bad writing. The advice is great for a tight-aggressive style of NL/PL. And it's pretty much the only TAG advice for NL in print that is good.

eboller · #3 09-30-2005, 01:10 PM

I think I'd read it after Harrington's book. You might find it more enlightening then. When I read it, I was looking more for a guide to get me started in NL...starting hands, what to bet, etc. You don't get that with the Ciaffone book. I think after reading Harrington the Ciaffone book will make more sense and the information will be more valuable.

Eric

burningyen · #4 09-30-2005, 05:30 PM

I do think you're missing something. Some of the most important big bet concepts I know I learned from that book. Maybe you're just a better player than I was when I read it and it's all obvious to you.

I see no difference whether you read that first or HOH1.

Beavis68 · #5 09-30-2005, 05:37 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I just picked up the Pot Limit and No Limit book by Ciaffone, based on recommendations from 2+2 members. This is my 10th poker book and I find it to be the worst written book I've seen. I'm not specifically talking about the advice, although I have some reservations about that, but many of his stories are hard to understand and seem to be pointless. I'm about 2/3 through the book and I'll probably finish it, but I also bought HOH V1 and I'm anxious to start it.

Am I missing something, or is the Ciaffone book grossly overrated?

[/ QUOTE ]

No, you aren't missing anything, Reuben's parts are pointless and wandering. The books try's to cover way too much.

The section "how big are you" is worth the price of the book though. I was very dissapointed in that book, it really needs to be updated and have some of the crap like London Lowball and 7-stud dropped, and expand the PLO8 section.

JohnG · #6 09-30-2005, 09:30 PM

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I'm not specifically talking about the advice, although I have some reservations about that

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Such as?

My own view is that it's a basic beginners book, but the best one there is on the subject, other than 'improve your poker'.

benkahuna · #7 10-01-2005, 06:27 AM

It's a collection of articles. If you don't like it stay far away from Card Player magazine.

I thought the section on stack sizes and how they play into your decision-making was excellent. The coverage there is unique though stack sizes are considered in HoH. I think ppl make too much out of it in terms of being a complete guide for NL play, but taken for what it is, I thought it was very effective.

Maybe Stewart and Ciaffone's writing just doesn't agree with you?

binions · #8 10-01-2005, 11:53 AM

[ QUOTE ]
I just picked up the Pot Limit and No Limit book by Ciaffone, based on recommendations from 2+2 members. This is my 10th poker book and I find it to be the worst written book I've seen. I'm not specifically talking about the advice, although I have some reservations about that, but many of his stories are hard to understand and seem to be pointless. I'm about 2/3 through the book and I'll probably finish it, but I also bought HOH V1 and I'm anxious to start it.

Am I missing something, or is the Ciaffone book grossly overrated?

[/ QUOTE ]

This is a great book. The chapters by Ciaffone are well written. You are clearly missing something.

Imperial · #9 10-01-2005, 12:08 PM

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is the Ciaffone book grossly overrated?

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Yes! Some good parts though..

BillsChips · #10 10-03-2005, 12:15 AM

The writing style does leave much to be desired, but that's not my only concern. I am new to NL (played live only 5 or 6 times in very wild games).

Interestingly, in GSIH, Ed Miller says "Big stacks hold no intrinsic advantage over small stacks in cash no limit hold'em games." From my very limited experience, I find this to be a reasonable outlook. I've been very successful using his small stack strategy.

Ciaffone, on the other hand, places an enormous amount of emphasis on starting with and playing a large stack.

I firmly believe that you learn by reading many takes on a subject, so I will finish it. At this point though, I won't be recommending the Ciaffone book.