Bet the TPWK and then fold

[mojobluesman]

I bet the top pair with the weak kicker because 2 players checked and there was only 1 player behind. Unfortunately he was the pre-flop raiser.

Was the bet correct?

Should I have check - folded?

I figured if I didn't bet I would have no idea whether he bet a weaker pair when it was checked to him.

Party Poker 0.50/1 Hold'em (10 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is MP2 with A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
<font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, UTG+1 calls, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, Hero calls, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Button raises</font>, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, BB calls, UTG+1 calls, Hero calls.

Flop: (8.50 SB) A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(4 players)</font>
BB checks, UTG+1 checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Button raises</font>, BB folds, UTG+1 folds, Hero calls.

Turn: (6.25 BB) 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
Hero checks, <font color="#CC3333">Button bets</font>, Hero folds.

Final Pot: 7.25 BB

[davelin]

FWIW I don't love the pre-flop limp.

I'm counting you at about 7 outs plus top pair wk. I'd call on this. This may be a continuation bet to reduce the field on buttons part.

[mojobluesman]

Now that I look at, I think I could have called to see the river. I'm really more interested in the flop though. I wasn't sure if I should bet.

[gharp]

I wouldn't fold the turn -- Button looks like he has a big A and you've got ~7 outs to beat him getting ~7:1.

I'm not sure I like the flop bet. I'm more inclined to play this one like a drawing hand and just check/call. This has the advantage of setting you up for a sweet field-trapping check/raise if you spike a 2 on the turn.

Betting does give you a little better idea of where you stand though, so you can feel better about folding the river. But you lose an extra bet on the flop for that information.

[closer2313]

I remember a discussion on this went something like...

Betting into a PFR to protect your hand doesn't really work. If its checked to a PFR and he bets, he could be betting a lot of hands. If he raises a bet, he probably has a stronger hand than yours (in most instances).

The way the flop came out, Im not sure if you have the best hand. I would check/call the flop. Check/Fold the Turn UI.

Another way to look at it though is, betting into the PFR will not really protect your hand. Look at this. Say, BB has 87 and UTG has 43. You have top pair, its a decent sized pot, you want them out so they cant outdraw you. You bet into the PFR, he raises, they fold their weak draws. So, did protecting your hand really work? Not exactly, because now the PFR probably has you drawing to 3 outs, so you actually had no hand to protect.

Now say he doesn't have you beat, say he has like KK.

Check/Check, you bet, he calls, they call.

Obviously it didn't protect your hand. Now watch this

Check/Check, you check, he bets, all 3 call.

Same thing as above, but now look at it. If you bet and are behind you get raised. If you bet and are ahead they will call anyway. If you check/call you get the same effect of being ahead without the risk of getting raised to see the turn.

Now, if you take the check/call line on the flop, the way the turn plays is read dependent.

The way this hand played out check/call, check/fold UI seems like the optimal line. Since you have 2 pair outs + a gutshot, you can call here I think.

But what if it went.

Check/Check/Check/Bet/3 calls on the flop
Then 3 checks/bet, 2 folds, now its up to you

or 3 checks/bet, 2 calls, now its up to you.

Ask yourself. Would the PFR bet a big pair again on the turn with the ace on board? Must he have an ace to bet here?

Would the other 2 players call the turn again with mid or bottom pair? Do they have to have an ace?

If you cant answer these, I think check/folding is best as default. If you can, let the reads dictate your action.

[@bsolute_luck]

FWIW: i'd play this way with other pocket pairs too.

i'm with davelin on the preflop limp.

i c/r that flop. if 3-bet, c/f the turn UI. that turn is an improvement, so i'm calling hoping to hit my 7 outer.

[mojobluesman]

I'm not sure I understand what's wrong with the pre-flop limp? Please explain.

Most players limp from early position with AXs (I don't unless the table is very loose and passive). This table was reasonably loose. So I was expecting at least another caller and perhaps a caller and the SB/BB.

[MrWookie47]

Nice post, duder. Looks like you're getting the hang of things around here.

I wouldn't raise this preflop. The 2 is too weak, and you want company when your chasing speculative flushes/straight draws. Since someone has already entered the steal from middle position trick is gone too.