Overpair Hand with pot-odds-question

#1 08-05-2005, 07:15 PM

Hi!

I was just playing a little to implement some ideas in my game at a nano-limit-table (I'm in the game only for 4 weaks now). And this is a hand I have mixed feelings about. Mainly because it contains a question about pot odds that bugs me. Maybe someone wants to comment my thoughts about it.

Here we go:

Ultimate Bet 0.01/0.02 Hold'em (9 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is CO with 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]. SB posts a blind of $0.01.
UTG calls, 2 folds, MP2 calls, MP3 calls, Hero raises, 1 fold, SB (poster) calls, BB calls, UTG calls, MP2 calls, MP3 calls.

Flop: (12 SB) 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (6 players)
SB checks, BB checks, UTG bets, MP2 calls, MP3 calls, Hero raises, SB folds, BB folds, UTG 3-bets, MP2 folds, MP3 calls, Hero caps, UTG calls, MP3 calls.

Here I thought: okay, you've got the overpair. My opponents are mostly weak. The pot is big and I wanted at least force SB and BB to call 2 bets cold and make life for the others a little more expensive. That is in fact something I was most unsure about: when my bet is raised somewhere in the field and it's now one bet for me to call, do I recalculate the pot odds with the additional bets after the raise? E.g. 5 bets in the pot, I bet, 2 calls, one raise. Do I have 10:1 now? This would make every hand that is profitable for one bet even more profitable if there is one raise and one bet to call that raise. Or do I have to consider that just like cold-calling the raise?
After the reraise I decided to cap the betting. I felt that I could actually be ahead although the board was paired and there were these two suited cards because a hand with a five in it isn't usually one you call a pre-flop raise with. And I wouldn't mind the one lost small bet but very much like the extra bets of the callers.

Turn: (12.50 BB) 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (3 players)
UTG checks, MP3 checks, Hero bets, UTG calls, MP3 calls.

I didn't feel threatened by the turn-card. I still had the overpair. My opponents had not shown any sign of trickyness in the past like check-raising. So I figured that the flop-reraiser had missed his flush-draw and wanted to check out if I had a made hand or was on a draw myself. So I decided to bet to get some more money in the pot and not give the possible flush draw a free card. I was reassured by being just called, not raised.

River: (15.50 BB) T[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (3 players)
UTG checks, MP3 bets, Hero calls, UTG folds.

The river card scared me because it was an overcard and put three to a flush on the board. Moreover the weak opponent now showed some initiative. So I decided to just call him down because I now thought I could very likely be beaten. The UTG folding reassured me, he was on a flush draw.

Final Pot: 17.50 BB

This is the hand. I hope I pointed out my fundamental problem with pot odds clearly enough. Maybe you can show me where I have leaks in my game and what concepts I have seriously misunderstood if that should be the case.

Regards,

Genz

Dopey · #2 08-05-2005, 07:53 PM

[ QUOTE ]

Ultimate Bet 0.01/0.02 Hold'em (9 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is CO with 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]. SB posts a blind of $0.01.
UTG calls, 2 folds, MP2 calls, MP3 calls, Hero raises, 1 fold, SB (poster) calls, BB calls, UTG calls, MP2 calls, MP3 calls.

Flop: (12 SB) 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (6 players)
SB checks, BB checks, UTG bets, MP2 calls, MP3 calls, Hero raises, SB folds, BB folds, UTG 3-bets, MP2 folds, MP3 calls, Hero caps, UTG calls, MP3 calls.

Here I thought: okay, you've got the overpair. My opponents are mostly weak. The pot is big and I wanted at least force SB and BB to call 2 bets cold and make life for the others a little more expensive. That is in fact something I was most unsure about: when my bet is raised somewhere in the field and it's now one bet for me to call, do I recalculate the pot odds with the additional bets after the raise? E.g. 5 bets in the pot, I bet, 2 calls, one raise. Do I have 10:1 now? This would make every hand that is profitable for one bet even more profitable if there is one raise and one bet to call that raise. Or do I have to consider that just like cold-calling the raise?
After the reraise I decided to cap the betting. I felt that I could actually be ahead although the board was paired and there were these two suited cards because a hand with a five in it isn't usually one you call a pre-flop raise with. And I wouldn't mind the one lost small bet but very much like the extra bets of the callers.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think your play is fine. Given how loose Ive heard thease games are I'd be a little worried about a 5 but your ahead enough for the cap to make sense.

As for your pot odds question you are getting 21:1 to call one more bet after UTG 3-bets (12 SB preflop + 3 SB form UTG + 1 SB from MP2 + 3 SB from MP3 + 2 SB you already have in the pot). This would make it an easy call even if you knew someone had a 5.

[ QUOTE ]

Turn: (12.50 BB) 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (3 players)
UTG checks, MP3 checks, Hero bets, UTG calls, MP3 calls.

I didn't feel threatened by the turn-card. I still had the overpair. My opponents had not shown any sign of trickyness in the past like check-raising. So I figured that the flop-reraiser had missed his flush-draw and wanted to check out if I had a made hand or was on a draw myself. So I decided to bet to get some more money in the pot and not give the possible flush draw a free card. I was reassured by being just called, not raised.

[/ QUOTE ]

Standard play given the fact it was checked to you.

[ QUOTE ]

River: (15.50 BB) T[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (3 players)
UTG checks, MP3 bets, Hero calls, UTG folds.

The river card scared me because it was an overcard and put three to a flush on the board. Moreover the weak opponent now showed some initiative. So I decided to just call him down because I now thought I could very likely be beaten. The UTG folding reassured me, he was on a flush draw.

Final Pot: 17.50 BB

[/ QUOTE ]

You are almost certainly beat but given the pot size it is a must call.

Generally well played.

Dopey [img]/images/graemlins/smirk.gif[/img]