The Israel Question

LostMyMoney · #1 05-13-2005, 10:50 PM

I was thinking about this after reading the recent threads on Israel and their independence.

In 1948 when Israel was given to the Jews what what happened to the nonjews who were already living in Israel's borders? Were they exiled?

If not, then what did giving Israel to the Jews even mean considering that it is a democratic state, couldn't you just say that the nation was made democratic and the rule is given to the majority (but now the Jewish holidays are national holidays)?

Who was in charge of the country before 1948? Were they exiled?

I should probably just look this up but would like to be taught by my friends on twoplustwo.

Thanks.

Arnfinn Madsen · #2 05-13-2005, 11:05 PM

I will reply with my first (and only [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]) positive thread about Israel.

Arabs and christians living within the declared Israeli territory has as far as I know been treated fairly well and they have the right to vote. It is those who are not citizens of Israel they treat like peace of [censored].

Cyrus · #3 05-16-2005, 05:09 AM

Congratulations for your enquiring mind.

I would recommend checking out this list, as part of your endeavors.

(My thanks to poster Gamblor who, tactfully, reminded me to post the list anew.)

jaxmike · #4 05-16-2005, 06:13 PM

[ QUOTE ]

Who was in charge of the country before 1948? Were they exiled?

[/ QUOTE ]

I may be wrong, but I am pretty sure that the land was under the control of the British. They gave up control to the newly formed Israeli government. Again, I am not sure, and don't have the time to look it up, I am heading out.

Cyrus · #5 05-16-2005, 06:29 PM

A poster seeks information and Jaxmike responds :

[ QUOTE ]
I may be wrong, but I am pretty sure that ... Again, I am not sure, and don't have the time to look it up, I am heading out.

[/ QUOTE ]

nicky g · #6 05-17-2005, 05:36 AM

"I may be wrong, but I am pretty sure that the land was under the control of the British. They gave up control to the newly formed Israeli government."

Actually they gave up control to the UN, which decided to establish two states in mandate Palestine, a Jewish and an Arab one; war broke out almost immediately and the plan was never implemented. At the end of the war Israel formed a state on about three quarters of the territory, while Jordan controlled most of the rest (West Bank) and Egypt a little (the Gaza strip) until the 1967 war.

In answer to the OP's question about the fate of the Arab inhabitants: the vast majority either fled or were forced to leave, and forbidden to return, with their property either seized by the Israeli government or, in the case of about 600 Arab villages, totally demolished. Many who didn;t flee also had their property confiscated in the following years.

jaxmike · #7 05-17-2005, 11:06 AM

[ QUOTE ]
A poster seeks information and Jaxmike responds :

[ QUOTE ]
I may be wrong, but I am pretty sure that ... Again, I am not sure, and don't have the time to look it up, I am heading out.

[/ QUOTE ]

[/ QUOTE ]

Sorry for providing basically factual information under the cavaet that I am not sure and that I don't have time to look it up to verify because I have better things to do with my time.

Gamblor · #8 05-17-2005, 11:54 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Congratulations for your enquiring mind.

I would recommend checking out this list, as part of your endeavors.

(My thanks to poster Gamblor who, tactfully, reminded me to post the list anew.)

[/ QUOTE ]

That list is almost exclusively written by left-wing radicals. These names are collectively the Michael Moore of Israel, with a slightly larger emphasis on academics.

Essentially, you're reading stuff written by people who are anti-Zionist, and in some cases anti-Jewish (Norman Finkelstein and others) from the get go, so you won't get the most unbiased information.

Benny Morris, for one, has been caught falsifying documents quoted in his book. In a huge newsmaking event in Israel a few years ago, the Israeli government made public the archives from the early days of the State. Some of Morris' claims about Ben-Gurion were proven false later. Morris has since backtracked on many of his statements in a recent Ha'aretz interview (Ha'aretz, of course, being the "USA Today" of Israel with a heavily left-leaning bias).

On another note, I'd like to see Egypt, Iraq, Jordan, Syria, etc. etc. open their archives to allow us to see exactly what they thought of Jews 5, 10, 25, 50 years ago.

andyfox · #9 05-17-2005, 12:01 PM

I hadn't heard about Morris falsifying documents. I have seen bogus accusations by Karsh about Morris. Is there anything else?

Also, do you have a basis for characterizing Finkelstein as anti-Jewish?

Cyrus · #10 05-18-2005, 03:55 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Do you have a basis for characterizing Finkelstein as anti-Jewish?

[/ QUOTE ]

Finkelstein's parents were in a Nazi death camp. (Theys survived.) Finkelstein has served in the Israeli military. He has never supported anti-Israeli terrorism; in fact, he is simply, but importantly, calling out that the emperor is naked.

Even when it's a Jewish emperor.