Performance Enhancers in Poker

[Saddlepoint]

I'm not 100% sure how to compose a prompt that will incite the kind of discussion that I think this warrants, but I really think that this issue deserves a lot of thought and I'm curious what everybody thinks.

To give a little background, Paul Phillips is apparently blogging the WSOP for Slate, and in his first article refers to how much medication has helped his play, in particular a psychostimulant called Adderall, originally perscribed to him for ADD (you can find the link on his LiveJournal). Also I recall Daniel Negreanu alluding to some medication he took for tournaments, presumably for similar reasons.

Look I'm really not sure how I feel, but I kind of think the issue warrants a monster discussion. In particular,

1. Do you think it's unethical for professional athletes to use chemical performance enhancers like steroids if they disclose it? Is there any fundamental difference between the use of CPEs in something like poker and the use of comparable products in baseball? Do you find either to be fundamentally unethical?

2. Where is the line between aid and performance enhancers? If steroids are unethical, why not chemical stimulants for memory and focus? What if they were taken by a Law student studying for a big test, so he could stay awake? Why not cold medicine? Or coffee? Or PokerTracker?

3. How many of you routinely use some sort of CPE in your playing? I'm talking about something you take specifically to improve your play.

4. Does the possibility of widespread use of these products in poker concern you? Do you believe use of medications like these could provide a measurable and siginificant edge over someone who chose not to use them? Stamina, focus, memory, etc? Or is it a non-factor in your mind, not worthy of concern?

5. How common do you think use of similar products are in poker? Among professional tournament players? Among cash players at various limits?

6. If you think use of CPEs in poker isn't a big deal and not worthy of discussion, do you think the whole MLB steroid scandal is a joke?

I'm not trying to be alarmist, really. But I think the issue is worthy of some examination, for one reason: if you, as a player, choose not to use chemical performance enhancers for ambiguous ethical reasons, you are giving up EV. You've been losing it since whatever has been on the market, and you're going to keep losing more as more and more people try and keep up. Not that there's necessarily a fundamental problem with that evolution, I just think that this being the case, it's worth it to define some of these "ambiguous ethical reasons" a little better, or even reconsider them altogether.

[scott8]

I really think its a non-issue.

I don't drink Red Bull b/c I believe it to be unhealthy.
Should others not be allowed to drink Red Bull b/c it gives them an advantage in stamina or alertness?

Take whatever medication you want/need. Its not my body and furthermore, unless you can see my cards, I simply don't care what you need to make you a better poker player.

-SC

[kiddj]

The drug using mentats will take over:

"It is by will alone I set my mind in motion. It is by the juice of Sapho that thoughts acquire speed, the lips acquire stains, stains become a warning. It is by will alone I set my mind in motion."

[mak1277]

I think you do everything you can within the rules to win. Since there are, to my knowledge, no poker tournament rules prohibiting any chemicals (performance enhancing or otherwise), then it's a complete non-issue. End of story in my book.

[regisd]

[ QUOTE ]

3. How many of you routinely use some sort of CPE in your playing? I'm talking about something you take specifically to improve your play.


[/ QUOTE ]

i'm thinking of trying a mix of lsd and speed. it worked for Dock Ellis when he pitched a no-hitter while high as a kite.

[michiganlaw]

[/ QUOTE ]

i'm thinking of trying a mix of lsd and speed. it worked for Dock Ellis when he pitched a no-hitter while high as a kite.

[/ QUOTE ]

Good luck figuring out if your hole cards are really pocket rockets or pocket deuces...I could see playing on speed or other stimulants (the sort Ungar is notorious for!!) but LSD? Wowzzzzza.....I'm all in, oh wait, I can't even see how many chips I have in front of me, are those yours, or mine?

[paperboyNC]

Because poker doesn't require physical skills, I could care less if my opponents take physical enhancements.

[michiganlaw]

[ QUOTE ]
Because poker doesn't require physical skills, I could care less if my opponents take physical enhancements.

[/ QUOTE ]

We're talking about mental enhancers, not physical enhancers. We're not suggesting that someone who takes anabolic steriods would be unethical...rather something along the lines of Adderral or some other prescription-based (more powerful than Red Bull) mental stimulant.

[Brad22]

David Wells pitched a perfect game for the Yankees when he had a massive hangover. That's the trick!!

Try playing your best poker when your reeling from the use of the drug, or hungover.

[RiverTheNuts]

[ QUOTE ]
David Wells pitched a perfect game for the Yankees when he had a massive hangover. That's the trick!!

Try playing your best poker when your reeling from the use of the drug, or hungover.

[/ QUOTE ]

You could also try the garter and breathing through your eyelids... meat