Help Me Laydown Cards!

Feltin Licter · #1 05-16-2005, 09:56 PM

I have one very bad weakness. I call TOO many big raises when i'm pretty sure i'm beat. I know this sounds dumb to some of you. I'm the guy holding AA who calls your $300 reraise with . The guy who calls your $200 pot size bet with a set when I know u have a flush. How do I make myself laydown cards!

Feltin Licter · #2 05-16-2005, 10:00 PM

My last hand, typical. I have AK. Flop A-10-2 rainbow. I bet pot, tight player raises, I call. Turn, 6. Now he bets $200 putting me all-in, I know I'm beat but I CALL! What is wrong with me! He shows a set of 10's !

rambozo · #3 05-16-2005, 10:58 PM

I feel your pain big guy. I have the same problem my self and just recently took sometime of to review things. I used to make that call and then guess what I'm going to be shown two pair or a set.

I taped a big sign on the side of my monitor not to make stupid calls anymore. Take alot of time to mull things over. I assume in AT2 flop hand that you raised and someone behind had called. You hit TPTK and made a pot sized pet I think that's probably OK but I think a bet of 2/3 of pot will achieve the same thing as a pot sized bet. Now you are looking at large reraise and bigtime warning bells should be going off in your head. The player behind you probably called your preflop raise with something pretty good. Try and determine what type of player your up against and what range of hands he would call the preflop raise with. Realistically the only thing you are ahead off here is a flat out bluff. Determine what type of hands you would be reraised all-in with 22, TT, AA, AT, A2, T2. We can probably eliminate A2, T2 and maybe AT depending on player types and how big the preflop raise was. Now try and determine what types of hands would be called preflop with that you are ahead here. I can only think of one hand that could possibly make this big reraise with is AQ and I find it doubtful any player would make an all-in reraise with this hand.

Take time and review the action. Remember there is no shame in folding.

Tony.T · #4 05-16-2005, 11:48 PM

Ciao!

First when you can fold a winning hand and still
feel good about your fold, this is one step towards
being a good player. It shows that the player does not think of poker in short term. This is very important. The decision regarding folding/calling should never be jugded afterwards by the outcome, because you can never know what the other guy is holding. You make a decision based on the info you have before the showdown/muck, if you where wrong make a note of it and take it into consideration next time you play the same opponent

I think you should start to give serious thought to why you play poker. For fun? To make money? As a living? Making a good value bet for 200 dollar and folding KK on a K high board when you know you a beat are two ways of making 200.
Its like a fotball team, you can´t have just a great offensive. If the defense sucks, you are going down anyway

Good luck!

THATWACOKID · #5 05-17-2005, 12:17 AM

I just got pokertracker about 2 weeks ago. To my suprise, my showdowns won was 52%. Calling river bets when I feel like I'm behind when I'm getting good odds is my biggest leak. It's almost like I know what they have, but I say to myself "I only have to win this 1 in 3 times for this to be + EV." I am almost always right when I think I am behind and I don't win anywhere near enough for these calls to be +EV. I think the fix for this is self discipline.

Feltin Licter · #6 05-17-2005, 12:32 AM

Maybe i need to get pocker tracker. I'm sure I lose with AA because of my problem of laying down hands. I actually play very well until I have to laydown a "good" hand and I call a huge raise. just need to figure out how to laydown "good" hands when my gut tells me im beat. Not sure what my problem is.

THATWACOKID · #7 05-17-2005, 01:24 AM

PT is awesome for getting reads on players. I've folded KK pre flop 3 times in the past week. Before I got poker tracker, I RARELY folded KK before the flop. It's also great for analyzing your own play. If you are a serious online poker player, PT is a must.

RoboRob · #8 05-17-2005, 02:17 AM

[ QUOTE ]
PT is awesome for getting reads on players. I've folded KK pre flop 3 times in the past week. Before I got poker tracker, I RARELY folded KK before the flop. It's also great for analyzing your own play. If you are a serious online poker player, PT is a must.

[/ QUOTE ]

How does folding KK 3 times imply PT is good?

ansky451 · #9 05-17-2005, 02:22 AM

[ QUOTE ]
PT is awesome for getting reads on players. I've folded KK pre flop 3 times in the past week. Before I got poker tracker, I RARELY folded KK before the flop. It's also great for analyzing your own play. If you are a serious online poker player, PT is a must.

[/ QUOTE ]

That is a ridiculous statement. If they were all correct you must be the best poker player in the world.

bkholdem · #10 05-17-2005, 08:32 AM

I think the issue often has to do with you expecting to win the pot at the outset of a hand (or on the flop).

I did this sort of thing for 3 months straight. I would chip away incremental wins over the course of a session and then piss it all away on one or two big hands. It was serious tilt and I didn't recognize it as such when it was happening.

I created a poker journal where I document my play and relevant info daily (such as emotional states or life issues that may be affecting me). At first I was writing stuff like... "I was upset about x today and I think it effected my play." Then it was "I recognized x was affecting me so I took a break".

As I studied my play I started to realize that, for me, what was going on was that I became angry at my opponent and tried to 'punnish him' by pushing a big stack of chips at him in a hand (when he was telling me I was beat) HAHAHAHA I'm glad I can laught about it now.

I 'GET ANGRY' and then act when it's my turn. This is BAD. I need to act after assessing the situation mentally. Emotion+Poker= No Cash.

In additon to my journal I also have a document where I list any and all leaks I identify (by reviewing my play and related issues daily) and write mantra's that I read every day before I play.

The one applicable here is someting to the effect of:

*Make decisions after evaluating and re-evaluating action by each player on each street.*

I still make the vast majority of my decisions quite quickly and 4 table but I pay attention to raises, flat calls behind a raise, etc.

I also have a similar type note that the other poster talked about sitting on the number keys of my laptop.

I'm just a small fry compared to you guys so I"m glad to see that I'm not the only one with leaks such as this. I think the key is identifying them and putting in the work to correct them. This is something I do daily.

p.s. I haven't pissed away too many chips since the implementation of documenting in a journal and creating, adding to, and reviewing my guide daily. The win rate actually turned around the very day I took these steps.