$11R hand here from last night

Jurollo · #1 03-29-2005, 01:00 PM

Hey everyone. This is a rebuy hand from last night, down to about 23, I am 22nd right now with 144K. I am not sure about the play here but I thought I could get him to lay it down after I have showed good hands all night and thought the only hands he calls with are those I am in a coin flip with. Questions for answering:
1) Is my play here bad? Should I fold this preflop
2) Is a push here the best line or is a stop and go more favorable?
3) Does he have the odds to actually call this? It looks iffy to me.
4) Should that UTG min raise make me be very weary of his hand rather than showing some weakness?

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t20000 (8 handed) converter

saw flop|saw showdown

UTG (t371885)
UTG+1 (t835612)
MP1 (t411028)
Hero (t142499)
CO (t224063)
Button (t385666)
SB (t242414)
BB (t212547)

Preflop: Hero is MP2 with 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
UTG raises to t40000, 2 folds, Hero raises to t141499, 4 folds, UTG calls t101499.

Flop: (t288998) 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)

Turn: (t288998) A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)

River: (t288998) Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)

Final Pot: t288998

Results in white below: 
UTG has 6c 6s (two pair, aces and sixes).
Hero has 5h 5s (two pair, aces and fives).
Outcome: UTG wins t288998. 

Thanks in advance.
~Justin

tiger7210 · #2 03-29-2005, 01:17 PM

I think his call is marginal at best. He had to assume it was a coinflip at best. He was quite fortunate you had a smaller pair. I like your play with your stack size. you needed to take a gamble and I can't see just calling here PF since that gets you no information and chances are there really are not too many pretty flops with a pair of 55's. As far as his raise is concerned, a miniraise from UTG can be a vary wide range of hands. I see lots of players do it with monsters but also with weak hands as a steal if the BB is fairly weak in defending. Overall though, I dislike his play in the hand more than yours. More often than not, I think you get a small pair to lay down and are in a coinflip when you get called.

hurlyburly · #3 03-29-2005, 01:38 PM

He just has too many chips to fight with. I'd make this play if my push was greater than 50% of his stack, but he doesn't have to call enough % of his stack to really feel pressured not to call.

I like to use the charts here to check my hand strength for these situations.

Simplistic · #4 03-29-2005, 01:43 PM

jurollo I was watching that hand. that really sucked to see him turn up 66.

if I'm in his position I might call to bust you...I actually made the same type of call with 66 vs 22...I agree with everyone in saying that it IS a marginal call.

Jurollo · #5 03-29-2005, 03:19 PM

[ QUOTE ]
He just has too many chips to fight with. I'd make this play if my push was greater than 50% of his stack, but he doesn't have to call enough % of his stack to really feel pressured not to call.

I like to use the charts here to check my hand strength for these situations.

[/ QUOTE ]

Well he is calling 100K more to win 288K so he is getting a decent price. However, a call and loss here knocks him down 7-9 notches in the standing and below average stack. This in itself lends me some folding equity. I didn't mind seeing the call as I thought I was up against either AA-TT, or AK-AT, KQ, KJs, or even QJs-QTs... However, I felt 99-22 would fold this up as well as any meak steal attempts. I was obviously wrong, but this brings up an interesting debate in that how much of your stack does it have to be to call to negate pot odds. I had 2 hands similiar to this where I attempted to steal with QTs in MP and each time the same guy pushed over the top of me all in for 110K or so, I had 330K with, 10K in pot from blinds/antes almost called because I saw myself against a low PP that didn't want a showdown, maybe AK-AT where I could have been in trouble. Makes you think about end game theory and how much is it worth risking to bust someone?
~Justin

pokerraja · #6 03-29-2005, 03:54 PM

You just ran into a better hand. I don't think your push or his call were incorrect. Your only options I believe were folding or pushing. Stop and go will not work since he will be first to act.

hurlyburly · #7 03-29-2005, 04:06 PM

I don't think he made a good call, FWIW.

Had he just called, I think your push would have been successful. Getting it in first is much better than pushing when you actually have a hand in these late stages, when the stacks are all pretty short on the blinds.

Lurshy · #8 03-29-2005, 04:06 PM

I hope this isn't hind sight talking....

Reraising an UTG raiser with a marginal PP? Unless you saw him stealing from ep often, or folding to reraises, this seems extremely risky imho. His call may be marginal with this particular hand, but he dominates you with many hands as well. You talk about your image, but what was his image?

If he didn't open, would you open push with 55 here with so many to act behind you? I know you are getting short stacked and coming into the blinds, and its sometimes correct to do so while you still have FE. If the answer is no, then it is certainly riskier to try to push a UTG raiser off his hand. He has demonstrated strength, and 55 while possibly ahead PF, likely won't be ahead after 5 more cards hit the board.

The Stop & Go is not an option here as he acts before you on the subsequent round. So you also will likely be looking at what to do when he bets the flop. Key to the S&G is acting 1st on the flop. Calling here PF with more to act behind you is asking for trouble as well.

BTW I went out today in a small buy-in tourney when I tried to resteal all-in with K9s in the SB and the open button raiser called me with 66. We were both below avg, I had him covered by a couple of hundred and went out a couple of hands later. I was playing laggy though, and I know people were waiting to come back over-the-top of and I deserved to be called at some point, but I figured to at least get trapped by a real hand....

Jurollo · #9 03-29-2005, 04:14 PM

Definately would have open pushed with the 5's to get the blinds, a meanigful steal attempt would have crippled me anyway so I would have pushed for blinds.
~Justin