Israel should unilaterally withdraw from the West Bank

[Wayfare]

And then build a fence around the green line to prevent Palestinian terrorists from getting in. After the Palestinians have their situation sorted out, they can resume relations with them.

A bunch of crazy settlers shouldn't spoil the economy for the rest of the country, and a few crazy terrorists shouldn't spoil the lives of the rest of the Palestinians.

Security issues shouldn't be a concern b/c Israel (still) has a better military than the rest of the region put together, U.S. backing, and enough nukes to defend itself against catastrophic attacks. The Arab world knows this.

Discuss.

[lastchance]

The minute Israel uses nukes, every scientist in the Arab world is going to try to give terrorists nukes. Nukes are much more effective in this day and age used as a countermeasure, to stop your opponent from using them. They are not offensive weapons, for you are almost assured of mutual annihilation.

[Gamblor]

A bunch of crazy settlers shouldn't spoil the economy for the rest of the country, and a few crazy terrorists shouldn't spoil the lives of the rest of the Palestinians

Crazy settlers are people too. And even if they are religious, they are still entitled to be religious.

And the second most holy site in Judaism is the Ma'arat haMachpela, the burial place of Avraham, Yitzchak, and Ya'acov, the three fathers of Judaism. It's in Hevron. As part of the peace deal with Jordan, it is under jurisdiction of the Islamic Trust, who have been slowly reducing the part that Jews are allowed to pray in, and as they expropriate more and more, are systematically removing any signs of Jewish history there.

The Demand for Equal Rights for Jewish People at the Ma'arat haMachpela

The third most holy site in Judaism is the burial site of Joseph, (i.e. of Technicolour dreamcoat fame) in Shechem, more recently renamed Nablus. Arab rioters torched it a few years ago and have steadily attacked Jews who have come by, under heavy IDF guard, to try to rebuild it.

PLO terrorists destroy Kever Yosef

Yet Israel allows a hundred thousand Arabs a day onto the Temple Mount, periodically refusing entry to younger men in times of extreme security threats. We're getting fucked in the ass on this one.

So what's the point?

The point is that settlers should be entitled to live in Yehuda and Shomron free of murderous violence, or at least free to visit their holy sites.

At the same time, any settler who kills an Arab outside of self-defence should be sentenced to jail, as they are now. Check out the recent post on http://littlegreenfootballs.com/weblog

[zaxx19]

ORRRRR, How bout the settlers leave "Palestine" and all the 1.3 million Arabs in Israel leave Israel seems fair to me Id make that deal in a second. I additionally dont think the settlers "hurt" the Israeli economy anymore than Israeli teens who are pamapered and unwilling to take on manual labor for the good of the country. In the long term cheap labor from the arabs is not necessary with more guest workers and more involvement of Israelis pampered yyouth in the labor pool.

[jakethebake]

Hold on a minute. You can't have this discussion w/o nicky g. Where is he? [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

[Gamblor]

I additionally dont think the settlers "hurt" the Israeli economy anymore than Israeli teens who are pamapered and unwilling to take on manual labor for the good of the country. In the long term cheap labor from the arabs is not necessary with more guest workers and more involvement of Israelis pampered yyouth in the labor pool.

Look whos talking americans hire spanish and every arab immigrant to drive your taxis and sweep your floors its the same thing

fine. you go drive a taxi and build construction. we need someone to do it, then we can kick the arabs out. oh, and work on a farm instead of all the indians and thais, so we'll have none of them either.

kids don't want to grow up to be janitors and garbagemen, they want to be doctors and lawyers and scientists and every kid wants to be a technician or engineer or computer programmer

[Wayfare]

First: Point about nukes is not that Israel would use them immediately, but that they would use them as a deterrent to prevent against the ending of the state of Israel. I think that reasonable people can agree that Israel would use its nuclear weapons before seeing the day that Arabs rule the country.

In my mind, the best way to ensure the long term instability of the region and the long-term weakness of Israel is to continue doing exactly what it is doing now -- waging a very costly (economically, militarily, and in the public relations area) war against Arabs that will almost ensure continuing conflict. Only by Israel weakening itself through this type of action will it be put in greatest danger.

Second: Just because sites are holy doesn't make them yours to take.

Third: By hurting Israel I mean directly contributing to the problem that is hurting Israel. If Israel stopped bowing to the tiny minority that is holding the entire rest of the country in the grip of retrobutive violence, everyone would be better off.

I suggest this to Israel because they are the "reasonable" side in this discussion. Only through unilateral action (Palestinian leaders have not been at all trustworthy) can Israel once again control its own destiny.

[chabibi]

I agree with wayfare in principal. Many of the religious settlers are just fanatics like the arabs, especially the ones in gaza. Unfortunately every time Israel reduces military presense the arabs assume they have achieved a victory, just like the Lebanon pull out. Building the wall will reduce suicide bombing but unilaterally withdrawing form the west bank will increase mortar attacks in towns close to the west bank like kfar sabaa. Removing all settlers from the west bank may be a good idea because lets face it, theyre gonna have to go eventually. But to ensure peace and security Israel has to keep a large military presence in the west bank

[Gamblor]

Second: Just because sites are holy doesn't make them yours to take.

It does if:

a) the Arabs will be destroy them without supervision and protection.

b) Arabs will not allow Jewish access to them.

[chabibi]

gamblor i didnt know you wre such a dos