How bad is this dealer error?

bdk3clash · #1 07-03-2004, 08:31 PM

SFer, SThief09, JohnnyBoomBoom, and I are playing 3/6 at the "New York Players' Club" in NYC. We've all folded this hand.

A horrible player is in EP. He is new to the game (as in, new to hold'em) and appears to have trouble reading the board. The concept of a kicker eluded him earlier, he didn't understand that his idiot-end straight lost, etc.

Anyway, an MP player had raised preflop and led the whole way. On the river, the board reads:

4 5 6 7 8

EP checks, MP bets, EP calls.

MP tables AA.

EP looks at the board, at his cards, at MP's cards, and says "they're good." EP prepares to muck his (as yet unshown) hand.

I am hanging my head and praying no one says anything about the straight on board.

At this point, the dealer says, "There's a straight on board, it's a chop."

I angrily tell the dealer "that's not cool" and point out his error.

How bad was this dealer's mistake? I thought he was incredibly out of line to say what he said. "Straight to the 8" would have been pretty much all I think he should say when MP tabled his hand. If EP wants to muck, let him muck.

As a side note, I think I got out of line after this hand in terms of lashing out at the dealer and not keeping the mood of the game friendly. I later apologized to the dealer and made it clear to the bad player that he did nothing wrong, but I nonetheless sucked the fun out of the game for a little while, which was wrong to do.

BigBaitsim (milo) · #2 07-04-2004, 12:38 PM

It's 3/6 and the guy is a newbie. I saw this sort of thing in Vegas a few times last week at the 3/6. I do not think the dealer made an error here. Yes, he pointed out something the fish did not know, but keeping the fish happy is important. I was pleased when a situation like this went in my wife's favor and not too unhappy when one went against me. Moron or not, the guy was entitled to half the pot.

slamdunkpro · #3 07-04-2004, 02:31 PM

If it's "cards speak" then the dealer made no error by announcing the correct decision.

bdk3clash · #4 07-04-2004, 02:36 PM

[ QUOTE ]
If it's "cards speak" then the dealer made no error by announcing the correct decision.

[/ QUOTE ]

What cards? MP tabled AA-"straight to the 8" is all the dealer should have said.

EP had yet to show his cards and was preparing to muck.

Thythe · #5 07-04-2004, 02:47 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
If it's "cards speak" then the dealer made no error by announcing the correct decision.

[/ QUOTE ]

What cards? MP tabled AA-"straight to the 8" is all the dealer should have said.

EP had yet to show his cards and was preparing to muck.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm not extremely versed in the intricacies of "cards speak," but I believe that you throw your cards face up and the dealer does the thinking for you. If you choose to muck, though, when you would be splitting the pot, then it's your fault and the dealer shouldn't point it out to you.

MrDannimal · #6 07-04-2004, 10:16 PM

I suppose that technically this is a dealer error, but in the long run I think it's a good thing to do.

This terrible player is what keeps poker alive. You don't want him busting out in 30 minutes and decidng that poker isn't as great as it looks on TV and never coming back. You want him to lose, but at a rate that keeps him coming back for more.

The dealer announcing the chop does two things for this guy: It gives him a good feeling about the room and it's staff ("I remeber that room, the dealer was nice and helped me out") and it keeps the guy at the table, because he now has 1/2 a pot more then he did otherwise (and, newbie-ness aside, he deserved half the pot).

Yeah, if you're the guy who stood to win the whole pot to the newbie, it stings. He'll get over it, and stands to make that back and more from the newbie if he keeps coming back. Everyone else doesn't get hurt at all, and they also benefit from the "coming back" aspect.

Just let it go. If you REALLY have a problem with it, talk to the dealer away from the newbie. But you're hurting yourself more by speaking up.

Schneids · #7 07-05-2004, 12:50 PM

[ QUOTE ]

Yeah, if you're the guy who stood to win the whole pot to the newbie, it stings. He'll get over it, and stands to make that back and more from the newbie if he keeps coming back. Everyone else doesn't get hurt at all, and they also benefit from the "coming back" aspect.

Just let it go. If you REALLY have a problem with it, talk to the dealer away from the newbie. But you're hurting yourself more by speaking up.

[/ QUOTE ]

I totally agree with this.

Do not think of each newb as anything else than a collective group. You want him coming back. You want each of them coming back. So, even if you do not get your $$ back from him personally, you are going to from the group as a collective whole.

bdk3clash · #8 07-05-2004, 12:53 PM

Excellent points in this thread, guys. I now realize I was way in the wrong here.

cardcounter0 · #9 07-05-2004, 01:29 PM

The dealer should have done everything in his power, and nitpicked every rule, in order to help you guys totally screw this fish. That way it would be almost 100% certain that he would never come back and donate to a game.

bdk3clash · #10 07-05-2004, 01:38 PM

[ QUOTE ]
The dealer should have done everything in his power, and nitpicked every rule, in order to help you guys totally screw this fish. That way it would be almost 100% certain that he would never come back and donate to a game.

[/ QUOTE ]

Sarcasm noted. [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]