How to play sets (new here and to limit)

#1 12-17-2005, 01:37 PM

I'm new to playing limit and a first time poster, so be nice. The thing I'm wondering about here is how to play sets on the flop? Do I just push and keep pushing? Here are two differnt hands from Party .50/1 10 handed:

Hand 1:

Preflop: Hero is UTG with 6[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 6[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
Hero calls, 2 folds, MP2 raises, 5 folds, Hero calls.

2 Questions here, should I limp UTG with 66, it's right on the line for SSHE depending on table. Once I've limped to I call the raise? It's down to heads-up so the pp should win often unimproved, but I'm OOP against a raiser and will have to fold to high cards and might be over-paired. Is 1:4.5 good enough odds to set a flop or fold with a low PP?

Flop: (5.50 SB) J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (3 players)
Hero checks, MP2 bets, Hero calls.

Now I've set my hand, do I push and keep pushing hoping he has a good J or over pair? What do I think about the [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]'s? I can't take away the pot odds to calling with 2 spade overs (if he thinks hitting the overs are outs). I just call to try to trap a little.

Turn: (3.75 BB) Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (3 players)
Hero bets, MP2 raises, Hero 3-bets, MP2 caps, Hero calls.

Now things go nuts. We cap the turn. Do I keep pushing here and bet for value? What is his range? AA-JJ, QJ, AQ, KQ AJ, KJ?

River: (11.75 BB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (3 players)
Hero checks, MP2 bets, Hero raises, MP2 3-bets, Hero caps, MP2 calls.

Ok, that could complete a straight, but with the capping on the turn I doubt that. Do I keep pushing the edge or slow down here? I'm still not sure how strong a hand has to be to cap it.

Hand 2:

Preflop: Hero is MP2 with J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
1 fold, UTG+1 calls, 1 fold, Hero raises, 2 folds, Button calls, SB calls, BB calls, UTG+1 calls.

Flop: (10 SB) J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (5 players)
SB checks, BB checks, UTG+1 checks, Hero bets, Button calls, SB calls, BB calls, UTG+1 calls.

Turn: (7.50 BB) T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (5 players)
SB checks, BB bets, UTG+1 calls, Hero raises, Button folds, SB calls, BB 3-bets, UTG+1 caps, Hero calls, SB calls, BB calls.

The 10 is dangerous but even if someone has the straight I still have the set to out draw them, it's probably worth a call?

River: (23.50 BB) 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (4 players)
SB checks, BB checks, UTG+1 checks, Hero checks.

Hmm, fairly weak card but the action on the turn was dangerous. Do I bet out here for value?

Thanks for the help. (I know there are other things I should work on but these stick out because they have the biggest swings on my stack).

Homer315 · #2 12-17-2005, 01:46 PM

Hand 1 is good. I like your line the whole way. It's fine to call the raise PF.

I might bet the flop, especially if the PF raiser is not too aggressive and might check the flop. The fact that he caps the turn surprised me, but I have no problem with you 3-betting. Don't worry about the str8 on the river. if you lost to a higher set, so be it.

Hand 2: without reads, it's harder, but the turn action definitely puts me in call down mode, BUT when it's checked through to me, I am betting that river for value sometimes. I'd be afraid of BB trying to check-raise the turn capper, but hey, I don't mind losing a lot of money with sets. Maybe it's a leak. [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

Eeegah · #3 12-17-2005, 01:55 PM

Hand 1: Don't bother with a slowplay, just bet out. MP2 will give you plenty of action, and there's no guarantee the other guy will stay in (where'd he go anyway)?

I don't see the reason for the checkraise on the river. He loves his hand; I'd probably just be and call a raise as he's starting to make it clear he has JJ or maybe QQ. PS: he doesn't have a straight--remember he raised preflop [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Hand 2: bet that river! the 5 didn't help anyone; no one has a straight because again, look at the preflop action. (Edit: well okay someone could have 89 but I'm not giving credit for that yet.

Eeegah · #4 12-17-2005, 01:59 PM

Diagnosis: You have Monsters Under the Bed, or MUBS. You convince yourself that the fact that a draw could be completed means that it is completed. Don't worry--I think every new player does the same, and it just takes experience to overcome it.

moa · #5 12-17-2005, 02:10 PM

Hand 1
Preflop - i don't limp utg online with 66 because there isn't enough multiway action to get implied odds. I think that calling a raise is about 0 EV. To give you and idea, when you have a low pp in BB, you need 1 caller to call a raise profitably. Here you're head up but the blinds are dead. A call is OK.
Flop: Theres a tonn of lines here. Bet out, Check/call, I often check raise/lead turn but that's just a personal preference.
Turn: Great bet! Too many ppl go for the check raise and miss a bet. It's much better to donk and get raised so that you can 3bet. NH. I would lead the river but the check raise might even be better. Good cap.
Hand 2
All streets are good, bet the river. 89 might not even raise so you'll lose 1 bet. You'll make up for it with all the bets you get from 2 pairs.

Greg J · #6 12-17-2005, 02:19 PM

Generally speaking, don't play your sets slow. Hand one is a good example of that. More aggression is needed on the flop. Either bet or check raise. I like a bet because then if villian raises you can set him up for a turn check raise (depending on the read). After that, you need to find a place to slow down after the turn. He likes his hand a lot, and a set of Js or Qs becomes increasingly likely with every bet he makes.

The limping 66 UTG used to be so right. However, games HAVE tighetened up in the past year. I still don't have a problem with the limp, but I guess I'm old school. But I do realize that folding it now would not be the crime it was a year ago at just about ANY .5/1 table. Without trying to get preachy about table selection, I will say that I'm sure there are still many tables at Party .5/1 were you should still not even think about folding this (though admittedly I have not played .5/1 in a long time -- so if anyone wants to offer some insight here please feel free).

Hand 2: That UTG+1 cap on the turn was weird. Still when it is checked to me on the river, I make a value bet. You don't always have to have the best hand to make this bet profitable.

#7 12-17-2005, 05:37 PM

Hand 1:
He had QQ so I lost set over set. I don't think there's anything I could have done. There are two many hands that like the Q that would bet the river that it's probably worth the 3-bet on the river.

Hand 2:
SB had KJ, so a pair plus the straight draw.
BB had TT, set the turn... we probably would have bid each other up on the river.
UTG+1 had Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]2[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] top pair plus the third nut flush draw. I'm not sure why he raised this, he might have figured he was gonna call and it was going to get capped, or maybe he though he had the best hand. (20% to win after the turn)

Reguardless I had the best hand here. If I had bet the river I probably would have gotten some action especially out of the BB who also had a set.

Over all I'm still struggling as to when to 3-bet and cap hands. Thanks

#8 12-17-2005, 05:43 PM

default = fast

#9 12-17-2005, 05:44 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Hand 1:
He had QQ so I lost set over set.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is so rare, that by convention, it's "your turn to lose a lot of chips."

goofball · #10 12-17-2005, 05:50 PM

How to play sets:

Bet and raise at every oppurtunity.