raise and fold

PokerBob · #1 12-01-2005, 06:37 AM

villain here is a fish (56/4/.8). Thoughts?
Party Poker 3/6 Hold'em (6 max, 4 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is BB with T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
1 fold, Button calls, SB completes, Hero checks.

Flop: (3 SB) 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (3 players)
SB checks, Hero bets, Button folds, SB calls.

Turn: (2.50 BB) 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
SB bets, Hero raises, SB 3-bets, Hero folds.

Final Pot: 7.50 BB

admiralfluff · #2 12-01-2005, 06:42 AM

perfect

climber · #3 12-01-2005, 06:45 AM

you think you are ahead of his bluff and want to raise for value?

you are trying to charge him more to draw to overs?

you dont like showdowns?

I dont like it. You pay the same as you would jsut to call it down and don't get to see that at least occassionaly the guy has 72o and just got pissed off at his wife right before making his mouse clicking decision.

admiralfluff · #4 12-01-2005, 06:54 AM

villain is passive. This is very rarely going to be 3-bet. Most of the time villain will calldown with his weaker junk. Often he will donk the river again. There is a lot of value in this raise, but the bet/3bet will almost always be set or better (I think he usually has the straight).

#5 12-01-2005, 06:56 AM

I don't like raising someone with an AF of 0.8 with just TPWK. I'd call down after he donks the turn. It's same price, and you see a showdown, make a note, feel better, etc.

Is is true that a passive will rarely 3-bet, and when they do you can fold safely. It also pushes them further from the optimal bluffing frequency (makes them bluff less). However, in this case there are too many crap draws he could've made. I'd be careful this time. Once I see his cards, I could decide how to play this next time.

Edit: I'm not sure whether calling down or folding to a 3-bet will make him bluff less. To me, knowing someone likes to take me to a showdown makes me bluff less against them. Knowing someone will fold to a raise makes me bluff raise more. But this guy is probably simple minded and will see a raise as a sign of strength and be more reluctant to bet into you in the future. I'm not sure about this, though.

POKhER · #6 12-01-2005, 08:49 AM

I dont like it, Either call him down or fold.

Raising achieves very little vs a .8 guy betting IMO.

What do you put villan on when he donk bets? hes a bit stupid not going for a C/R with a set though.

PokerBob · #7 12-01-2005, 05:00 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I dont like it, Either call him down or fold.

Raising achieves very little vs a .8 guy betting IMO.

What do you put villan on when he donk bets? hes a bit stupid not going for a C/R with a set though.

[/ QUOTE ]

maybe a 6, a 7 or a [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] draw.

jba · #8 12-01-2005, 05:05 PM

nice hand

Peter Harris · #9 12-01-2005, 06:02 PM

i dig it, this player will not 3bet a spade draw; i reckon 87, 56 and 66 are all possibilities that would see bet/3bet from a 0.8er

27offsooot · #10 12-01-2005, 06:59 PM

In position + small pot for me = call down. I've seen even passive players three bet crap before in similar situation. You're not ahead often enough to call down obviously after the three bet, but i would rather just keep it simple and not put myself in that position. Grant it, your hand is vulnerable, but letting him draw to 6 outs or whatever in a small pot isn't a big deal. I would rather he continue bluffing the river if he has air and not be vulnerable to retarded bluffs by bad players that could be 1. tilty 2. not f-ing able to read there hand 3. drunk.

BTW, what was ur plan on a range of rivers if he called?