Let's talk marginal aggression.

[Diplomat]

10-20 with a full kill, B+M. I am on the button with KTs of [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]. UTG is a poor player at the best of times. He does this funny studder-step with his chips like he wanted to raise, then thought he should call, then raised anyway. It looks legit, not like an act. 4 people cold-call, as per usual. I decide to play tuna and see how fast I can swim. Both blinds call as well.

The flop is T [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]4 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]3 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]. UTG bets, all 4 call. I raise. A terrible player in the small blind cold-calls. UTG calls. All the limpers between call.

The turn is the 7 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]. SB checks, UTG pauses for about 3 seconds, then bets again. One of the limpers call, I raise. The SB cold-calls again. UTG thinks for a few seconds, then regretfully calls. The limper folds.

The river pairs the 7. Checked to me, and I go pussywillow and check.

Bleh, Meh, or WTF?

-Diplomat

[mike l.]

you played it perfect. what's your question? the river aint puss it's plus, as in plus EV.

[rigoletto]

Yep, I like it too!

[Diplomat]

What is my question about? The beginning and the end, ie. wtf was I doing in a raised pot with KT, and is there value in a river bet?

-Diplomat

[mike l.]

"What is my question about? The beginning and the end, ie. wtf was I doing in a raised pot with KT, and is there value in a river bet?"

this is gonna sound dumb, especially on here, but that laydown preflop is semi-expert. most of us, and by that i mean intermediate players (and face it guys that's a bunch of you), make that call liking our position, liking our implied odds, thinking we can play it so well postflop compared to our opponents, and doing and saying whatever we can to delude ourselves from the fact that it's a lousy piece of mega-dominated sheeit. so i didnt even think about preflop, just as most of us dont. we just go on making the suck error and sucking. so good for you for pointing that out.

as for the end, no that's where i think you redeemed yourself. utg is screaming overpair when he stop gos the flop turn. if he has 99 then oh well, but most of the time he has retardedly played JJ-AA.

[doggin]

Of all his quotes, you managed to dig up this one.
By the way, how many aircraft carriers are named after
you?

[Diplomat]

I'm not really sure I want to be named after an aircraft carrier. My ego is big enough as it is.

I've also got a quote about jellybeans from him. I'll switch in that one in a few days.

-Diplomat

[mikelow]

Well, having decided to call preflop--we've all done worse things than that!, you played it well. But I would risk a river bet against this field. Does the preflop raiser have an overpair?

The one thing that justifies a check on the river is that you have a tell and the preflop sucker had JJ.

[doggin]

My bad. I'm sure you'll have enough defenders here.
So, do wild dogs run in packs up there too?

[elysium]

hi diplomat
yeah, you need to bet it here. you have good posts diplomat because i can tell by your description where you are in the hand. you have them beat. here, you are likely out kicking. you have a value bet. by the way, this hand exemplifies an 'in the good range' value bet into a 3-way. we see here how the cards AND conditions give diplomat a greater than 2 to 1 lead over both opponents combined. if diplomat had the Q as kicker, he no longer has a value bet and should check it down. this is on the cutting edge of what you need to value bet from LP in a 3-way on the river. if one or both of diplomats opponents were terrible players, he could value bet with a J kicker. if, however, diplomat had a maniac in the field, he would need to be stronger than this to value bet because of the threat of a bluff-raise. if both opponents were passive, he could value bet with a J kicker because many hands worse would call, but more importantly he wouldn't be raised. if a weak tight were in there, now diplomat must be stronger because the weak tight might easily be calling with a better hand. he would need trips against the weak tight.