Standard?

krishanleong · #1 04-11-2005, 07:23 PM

Party Poker 5/10 Hold'em (6 max, 6 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is BB with K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
UTG calls, 3 folds, SB completes, Hero checks.

Flop: (3 SB) 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (3 players)
SB checks, Hero checks, UTG bets, SB calls, Hero raises, UTG folds, SB calls.

Turn: (4 BB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
SB checks, Hero bets, SB calls.

River: (6 BB) Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players)
SB checks, Hero bets, SB calls.

Final Pot: 8 BB

djoyce003 · #2 04-11-2005, 08:01 PM

yeah....on raggedy flops i go for the flop checkraise. If you really know you opponent will fire two bullets, i wait for the turn. I see this get checked through a lot on the turn though, and people tend to fold out there, so i go ahead and get the money in now while i can.

PassiveCaller · #3 04-11-2005, 08:10 PM

I'd lead here most of the time and just call a reraise, attempting to check-raise. If UTG is pretty certain to bet & keep betting then calling and waiting for the turn has its merits.

Surfbullet · #4 04-11-2005, 09:38 PM

I like to bet the flop with the intention of 3-betting if given the opportunity, as there is no guarantee that UTG will bet the flop (or the turn) given the open-limp preflop. The flop c/r accomplishes the same thing but IMHO UTG betting the flop is unreliable at best unless you have a read.

Also, going 3-bets on the flop(or 2 with a successful c/r) will make this a decent sized pot by the turn, and will be more likely to induce a call down, while a turn checkraise in a smallish pot would be more likely to fold out hands b/c it shows so much strength.

Additionally, this avoids giving free cards, which aren't that big a risk to your winning but make getting callers less likely b/c the pot will be only 1.5 BBs on the turn.

There is an argument for a slowplay here as well, however I personally like to try and build the pot early here to tie any callers to at least 1BB on both the turn and river to get to showdown instead of risking them folding the turn after not getting any bets on the flop.

In short, I like the flop c/r when you can count on UTG to bet, but I feel it is read-dependent and makes betting the flop a better choice.

Surf

krishanleong · #5 04-11-2005, 09:43 PM

I had a read I didn't give in this instance. I agree that leading/3-betting is a good option against unknown. I also agree that any line involving checking with the intention of checkraising isn't very good without a strong read.

Krishan

MarkL444 · #6 04-11-2005, 09:44 PM

what surfbullet said.

Surfbullet · #7 04-11-2005, 09:46 PM

Cools. Include your reads then, so we can incorporate them into our decisions as you would have at the table! [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Also, had you checked with the intention of raising the turn? Or was the c/r planned because you could count on UTG to bet?

Surf

Surfbullet · #8 04-11-2005, 09:46 PM

w00t! I think I'm finally starting to understand this stuff. A little.

Surf

___1___ · #9 04-11-2005, 09:51 PM

krishanleong,

I don't care for the flop checkraise at all. The absolute last thing I want to do is have the flop checked through and give any gutshot a free card.

Bet and hope to 3-bet. On the other hand, if you "know" that UTG will bet when checked to (as is customary in the 5/10 game) then your play is perfect...

___1___

krishanleong · #10 04-11-2005, 10:30 PM

[ QUOTE ]

Cools. Include your reads then, so we can incorporate them into our decisions as you would have at the table

[/ QUOTE ]

I do usually. In this particular situation I had a little read but also thought cring the flop was standard with no reads. It sure feels like a limper will always take a shot against the blinds. So the comments I got were perfect for me. I now know the standard line against unknowns is to lead.

Krishan