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  #1  
Old 02-10-2005, 04:06 PM
zepmetal zepmetal is offline
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Default What do I need to evaluate here?

Party 2/4 NL 6max...a generally profitable game, as you well know.

2 players limp, I raise AsKh to $16 form CO, Button calls, BB calls, 2 limpers call.

Flop($80): Js, Ts, 6s

Checked to me, I check, Button bets $75, others fold. Here's my question. He has $170 left, and I have him covered. I am going to evaluate the situation and decide to fold or push. What would I need to conclude in order to decide that pushing is correct?
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  #2  
Old 02-10-2005, 04:07 PM
Kaz The Original Kaz The Original is offline
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Default Re: What do I need to evaluate here?

How good a hand he needs to make that bet, and what sort of hands he can call your push with.
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  #3  
Old 02-10-2005, 04:12 PM
mgsimpleton mgsimpleton is offline
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Default Re: What do I need to evaluate here?

I've played that game and I've seen that bet made with KsJh or AJ or really any range of hands. With no specific read on the player, I would say it's an easy push since the fold equity is huge and barring a made flush, you have several outs to the nuts.
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  #4  
Old 02-10-2005, 04:12 PM
Usagi_yo Usagi_yo is offline
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Default Re: What do I need to evaluate here?

I believe that you would have to conclude that one of your overcards is good, should you hit it, and that your opponant is capable of folding top pair with overcard kicker -- redraw to the flush or not.
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  #5  
Old 02-10-2005, 04:30 PM
NickPoker NickPoker is offline
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Default Re: What do I need to evaluate here?

Ask:
What are his range of hands? to expand that question What range of hands could he have that I am already beating (flush or str8 draw for example)
How many outs do I have he is beating me right now? To expand this question calculate your outs with the A and/or King being good, and without?
Do I want him to call? This is relevant because if you want a call you may want to mini raise instead of Push.

On this specific hand without a read I would say you want to Push, and not really care if he calls or not (a fold may be slightly preferable). You have 9 outs to the nut flush, 3 additional outs to a str8 (not inlcuding the Q [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]). This makes the hand close to a coin flip, throw in the Aces or Kings that may win the hand for you, the chance your opponent is on a draw, and the money already in the pot I think it is an easy Push.
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  #6  
Old 02-10-2005, 05:46 PM
zepmetal zepmetal is offline
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Default Re: What do I need to evaluate here?

I feek that most of my profit here comes from fold equity. My inclination is that button was betting a pair of jacks, possibly some smaller pair, and figured he could take it without a fight by betting big. So, I pushed and button insta called with K8s. I didnt hit my flush.

Button's bet was only pot sized, but it was still a large bet for the game (I would typically expect a wimpy bet from a questionable hand that wants to "feel it out"). Button made an excellent play by ensuring he'll get allin against a lower flush, and killing odds to the As.
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  #7  
Old 02-10-2005, 06:06 PM
iceman5 iceman5 is offline
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Default Re: What do I need to evaluate here?

Look at the hand from his perspective.
You raised $16 preflop. You checked when the flop was JTx all spades. He knows you would bet AA, KK or QQ especially if you had a spade.
He knows you wouldnt check raise all in with the nut flush.
You wouldnt check a set with all spades on the flop.
Its pretty obvious what you have when you check raise all in.

Of course this time it doesnt matter. Hes not folding that hand. If hes calling raises with K8s, you probably got your money back later though.
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