Hand vs. Entity

cold_cash · #1 04-18-2005, 01:46 AM

So far both of us are at least somewhat behaving, other than a one hand mishap on Entity's first hand where he posted and then immediately started spewing chips with a fire hose.

I can think of one thing I would have done differently, and one thing I should have done differently.

How would you play it?

(There's also someone all in before the flop.)

Party Poker 0.5/1 Hold'em (10 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is UTG+1 with Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
1 fold, Hero raises, 1 fold, MP1 calls $1.50 (All-In), 5 folds, BB(Entity)/ calls, Hero 3-bets, BB(Entity)/ calls.

Flop: (11.50 SB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (3 players, 1 all-in)
Entity checks, Hero bets, Entity calls.

Turn: (6.75 BB) T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (3 players, 1 all-in)
Entity checks, Hero bets, Entity calls.

River: (8.75 BB) J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (3 players, 1 all-in)
Entity checks, Hero bets....

Ianco15 · #2 04-18-2005, 01:48 AM

I would have played it exactly the same way. What am I missing?

Entity · #3 04-18-2005, 01:48 AM

For the record, my preflop call was not paying attention (i.e. was a huge mistake) as the g/f just switched the TV to Viva la Bam and I got distracted.

Entity · #4 04-18-2005, 01:49 AM

[ QUOTE ]
I would have played it exactly the same way. What am I missing?

[/ QUOTE ]

How much value is there in a river bet? Do you have to pay off a checkraise?

SCfuji · #5 04-18-2005, 01:50 AM

wild boys > viva la bam.

dr. klopek · #6 04-18-2005, 01:52 AM

You got into trouble when you three bet your raise on the flop.

I'm pretty sure this is how I'd do it.

[ QUOTE ]
wild boys > viva la bam.

[/ QUOTE ]
^This is wrong, btw.

Ianco15 · #7 04-18-2005, 01:54 AM

Good point. Seeing as how you appear to be on a draw, and the jack puts a 4 straight on the board... checking behind on river is a good play.

Against a normal micro player I would still bet the river because of they could have any number of hands and I think a river value bet is positive EV.

bottomset · #8 04-18-2005, 02:00 AM

please represent 94o Entity

Entity · #9 04-18-2005, 02:01 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Good point. Seeing as how you appear to be on a draw, and the jack puts a 4 straight on the board... checking behind on river is a good play.

Against a normal micro player I would still bet the river because of they could have any number of hands and I think a river value bet is positive EV.

[/ QUOTE ]

Here's how it works. I look at the board and realize that cash isn't going to bet AK or AQ for value on the river hoping I'll call with a worse ace. Since he won't value bet AK on the river here, I can't call with a hand like middle pair. So since he's value betting (or appears to be), I have to fold the river unless I have a straight or two pair.

But...since he knows I know that, he shouldn't bet an overpair here often either, because he has to pay off my checkraise due to the potential of a river bluff-checkraise.

Then we get into all crazy sort of stuff like the fact that he should bet AK because I'm capable of folding 86s because he shouldn't be betting AK...and it gets all funky.

Since cash and I haven't developed that sort of trust/untrust relationship yet and I mostly trust his bets and he mostly trusts my checkraises (I think), I should fold this river and he should probably check this river. Also, then I get to call him a nit for not valuebetting an overpair.

cold_cash · #10 04-18-2005, 02:01 AM

[ QUOTE ]
You got into trouble when you three bet your raise on the flop.

[/ QUOTE ]

The all-in guy raised it like half a bet, so I could raise again when it came back around.

(This is also one of the quesitonable parts of the hand I think I would have played differently if I could do it again. I did not know Entity was mesmerized by a Menudo concert and therefore not paying attention. Since that was indeed the case I guess capping was clearly the right move.)