Overcards on co-ordinated flop

[DavidC]

PP 2/4 9 players

SB/BB post. Hero is utg with: [ Qc As ]

PF: Hero raises, utg+1 calls, folded to SB who calls, BB folds.

** Dealing Flop ** [ 6d, 7d, 8s ], 3 players, 7 bets.

--------------------

Villains are 89/4/0.9 (28 hands), and 28/4/0 (25 hands).

They've been going to showdown quite a bit.

SB checks to me.

What's my line?

[@bsolute_luck]

check/call 1 back, fold if bet & raised. check/fold turn UI. this pot probably hit someone enough that betting isn't going to win the hand, but they could bet with an OESD/flush draw or a single pair. plus i don't care if UTG checks this through.

[DavidC]

[ QUOTE ]
check/call 1 back, fold if bet & raised. check/fold turn UI. this pot probably hit someone enough that betting isn't going to win the hand, but they could bet with an OESD/flush draw or a single pair. plus i don't care if UTG checks this through.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is the line that I ended up taking (UTG bet, SB folded), except that I had AQs spades (BDF).

Does that change things at all?

[invictus33]

The blinds are coming in this pot with anything, so it's hard to put them on a range. I'd bet this one and fold to a c/r. That may buy you a free ride to the river as well.

[Webster]

I'd bet and fold if anybody else is looking aggressive. Hey - the board is scary to them also. If the turn makes it even MORE scary I check/fold but untill someone smacks me in the face or the board goes from ugly to nighttmare I'll stay in charge.

[chaz64]

[ QUOTE ]
I'd bet and fold if anybody else is looking aggressive. Hey - the board is scary to them also. If the turn makes it even MORE scary I check/fold but untill someone smacks me in the face or the board goes from ugly to nighttmare I'll stay in charge.

[/ QUOTE ]

I was thinking this also - the board is scary to them as well. But you would not think this board helped a PF raiser who is more likely to have two big cards than an overpair. There is an example of reverse implied odds in ToP - hero has two black aces and board is something like T97, all hearts, correct play is to check-fold the aces. Do reverse implied odds apply here?

[fizzleboink]

With their pre-flop range, I think there cold-calls could mean anything. This board hits a lot of hands that they will have, and will probably take it to the river. "They've been going to showdown quite a bit" is enough for me to check-fold this flop.

You should probably discount your overcard outs to 3 because you won't win everytime you hit one, so you need pot odds of roughly 15:1. So calling is wrong in my opinion.

If you bet, you need both of them to fold 1 in 7 times in order for this to be profitable. Do you think they will? I don't.

"Bet against 2, check against 3" isn't a good rule.

[fizzleboink]

[ QUOTE ]

I was thinking this also - the board is scary to them as well. But you would not think this board helped a PF raiser who is more likely to have two big cards than an overpair. There is an example of reverse implied odds in ToP - hero has two black aces and board is something like T97, all hearts, correct play is to check-fold the aces. Do reverse implied odds apply here?

[/ QUOTE ]

I think they do unless you can fold any 4,5,6,7,8,9,10 or diamond on the turn or river.

[2+2 Junkie]

grunching.

I have this problem a lot, but here is what I do. I put in a flop bet and see what happens. I normally go to check/call, check/fold after that if I don't improve. Interested to read the others to find the fault in my play.

[numeri]

[ QUOTE ]
I have this problem a lot, but here is what I do. I put in a flop bet and see what happens. I normally go to check/call, check/fold after that if I don't improve. Interested to read the others to find the fault in my play.

[/ QUOTE ]
Why call the turn with your line? You won't have the odds even if everyone calls your flop bet and you have a full 6 outs for your overcards.