[Exsubmariner]

"it's calculus."

They must have failed that class, thus the reason for becoming politicians. I submit there is no political capital to be gained opposing the war. Unless, that is, you believe having Cindy Sheehan on your side is vital to winning the next election. And if that's the case, you will probably loose the next election and think it's because you haven't gotten your message out.

How's that for a straw man? You really burnt down that last one I made. In fact, I don't think there's anyone anymore who fits the description that the President gave, I'm convinced now he just dreamed the whole thing up.

So now you've disagreed that the war is going badly and stated you hope we win, but the point of this thread was not to support the defeatists, or to defend them, just disagree that they are defeatists.

Glad we got to the bottom of it. Man, you've won me over.