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Old 10-19-2005, 03:39 AM
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Default Re: Was this ruling good? (Bay101Live Tourney)

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Cards that hit the muck pile are dead. Period. The TD was wrong to fish your cards out. However, if the player failed to act and the dealer declared the hand complete then it should be his loss, not yours.

I've had something similar happen to me in the past - the dealer actually grabbed my cards into the muck pile by accident while I was in Seat 1 and happened to be all-in. I hadn't moved them away from the rail, looked over at a friend on the rails and turned back to find my cards gone. It was purely an accident on the dealers part, however the rules specifically state that cards that hit the muck pile are dead and out of play. The other players at the table even argued on my behalf, but the TD would not fish any cards from the muck pile. I had to pay the consequences. I was refunded the difference in chips that weren't covered by other players and watched as the flop came to make what would have been a set for me and the winning hand. I played the board and lost. This was with 12 players left and the tournament paid out 9 places. It's tough to swallow but those are the rules.

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Am I the only one who feels like "those are the rules" is often an incredibly crappy defense? Any number of things could have been done here that were more fair including pulling your cards out of the muck. If that upsets some people, then you could be refunded all of your chips, and the rest of the players could then act as they wished. The hand could be declared dead and dealt over. Perhaps the worst alternative would be that you are dealt two random cards and at least allowed to play those. In situations where the player could be acting wrongly to gain an advantage, then a rule like this must stand. However, when it is an obvious dealer error, then another reasonable course of action should be taken (or perhaps, a more reasonable rule should already be in place to dictate what happens here). No one folds after going all-in.

Will
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