[Buzz]

AKsPRO - I think I see what you're saying - and at first glance it makes sense.

If you hold A278 and the flop is 478, then you have the nut low and also two pairs.

There isn’t any flop for A2TK where you can have the nut low and also two pairs.

If the flop is 478, then A2TK has no pairs. Or if the flop is 4TK, then A2TK has two pairs but only a back-door low draw.

Thus at first it looks as though A278 has the advantage over A2TK.

But it doesn’t. Not really. You’re only considering a few specific flops. Also, you’re considering flops and not five card boards on the river. It’s true that when the flop has a seven and an eight, A278 has a better flop fit than A2TK. And even when there is only one seven or eight included in a three low card flop, A278 has a better flop fit than A2TK.

But what if the flop has no low cards? When the flop is 9JQ, which hand would you rather have?

Or what if the flop has only one low card, say a four, and two high cards? When the flop is 49Q, which hand would you rather have?

Or even if the flop has two low cards, but neither is a seven or eight, say 36J? Which hand is better? And even if the flop has a seven or eight, and pairs your A278, but (to be fair) also has a king (which pairs the A2TK hand). Which hand is better?

A2TK is a better starting hand than A278 because it ends up with more winning hands on the river than A278. When those high cards connect, they make a better hand on the river more often than when the middle cards connect.

Don’t misunderstand. It’s true that A278 sometimes connects with the flop and board better than A2TK. For example, if the flop is 777, then we’d all rather hold the A278. And 777 can happen just as often, when you hold A278, as TTT can when you hold A2TK.

But when the board on the river is 348JK, although both A278 and A2TK have the nut low, and although both also have one pair, in a heads-up contest it is the hand with the higher pair that gets the 3/4.

Or when the board on the river is 378TK, although both A278 and A2TK have the nut low, and although both also have two pairs, the hand with the higher two pairs is the winner for high. The same principle is true of straights or flushes. The higher straight or flush prevails.

In general, high cards have an edge over middle cards in making high hands. But you can put things together such that hands with middle cards have the advantage.

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When you hit the flop with possible low (78Q, 356 and so on), those middle cards add you much more value for your A2 than high cards like KT or even JJ.Yes once in a while you hit 78J for you A2JJ, but this is so rarely.

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I'll agree that XY78 fits with a low card flop better than XYJJ. But I think the XYJJ ends up with a winning high more often in a full limit game than XY78. The same is true (but to a lesser extent) of XYTJ.

I hope I've made it clear to you, because it's crystal clear in my own thinking.

Buzz