[udontknowmickey]

a few points, and then this really will be my last post.

1) I agree with you in all that you've said about predestination and and human responsibility, I was merely pointing out that the term "human responsibility" is not to be found in the Bible.

2) I had already previously pointed out that there is no feeling of 'being forced' like it's unwilling in the context I was speaking about. If it is God's will that an apple would fall from this tree, the apple has no choice in the matter. Likewise, if it is God's will hat Pharoah will harden his heart and not let the hebrews go, then Pharaoh has no sense that "no, I want to let them go." If it's God's will that David takes a census and chooses to incite satan to do so, there is no thinking on David's part "I feel like God is making me take a census, but I don't want to". If it's God's will, then it will be done, no feelings of being force.

3) If we deny that God is sovereign and active over every aspect of our life (and the universe for that matter), we're left with the question: then how does the universe run?

Do we have a watchmaker God now?

4) I have already given a reason for how divine sovereignty and human responsibility are logically compatible. The inconsistancy lies within our false presupposition that: responsibilty presupposes freedom.

Instead, responsibility presupposes a judge who will hold us accountable. An omnipotent, omniscent judge and a system of rules we will be held accountable to.

If we were under no one's control, but no one would hold us accountable for what we did, we would no longer be responsible.

And before I am accused of equivocating, notice the wording used in the passage of Romans 9:

19You will say to me then, "Why does he still find fault? For who can resist his will?" (ESV)

19One of you will say to me: "Then why does God still blame us? For who resists his will?" (NIV)

19(AK)You will say to me then, "(AL)Why does He still find fault? For (AM)who resists His will?" (NASB)

Notice the wording across the board is God judging us. Not us "having" human responsibility. We are responsible because God judges us.

My point throughout this series of posts was not to put the blame of sin on God, but to point out that it is illogical to say that God isn't the author of sin of we do in fact preach predestination. It's not like it's a sin to be the author of sin anyways. We are too quick to run away from terminology that should not scare us.

Ok, that's my last post then. Notready, you may have the last word.