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Old 12-13-2005, 05:47 PM
BadBatsuMaru BadBatsuMaru is offline
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Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 90
Default passive play in passive games, rakes, and the current state of 2/4 BBJ

For reference:

my stats from 23K 2/4 BBJ hands

my original thread which was locked

my thread whining about locked threads which was turning into a good thread with an OT title

Evan's thread about blind stealing that shant referenced

My basic 2/4 BBJ stats are:

17.53% VP$IP, 5.09% PFR
2.4 flop / 2.4 turn / 1.8 river aggression

Notice my blind steal attempts are a pathetic 15%, but also notice that I am only in stealing position on 2.7% of hands because of game selection, and of the 94 steal attempts I have made, NONE have won without a flop.

I've made 2.16 BB/100 over those 22,983 hands, and pots I've won have been raked for $2,113.50, which is 2.30 BB/100 rake.

So, obviously my play is pretty weak/tight, but I'm wondering if that may be correct given my game selection. With 2.3 BB/100 going to the rake, I have a feeling that I pretty much need to find tables with VP$IP over 30% (really looking for 35%) and preferably an average PFR under 5% where I can stay out of marginal situations entirely and my big hands are going to be paid off.

The rake structure for 2/4 BBJ is:
$20 pot = $1.00 regular + $0.5 JP = $1.50 rake = 7.50%
$30 pot = $1.50 regular + $0.5 JP = $2.00 rake = 6.67%
$40 pot = $2.00 regular + $0.5 JP = $2.50 rake = 6.25%
$50 pot = $2.50 regular + $0.5 JP = $3.00 rake = 6.00%
$60 pot = $3.00 regular + $0.5 JP = $3.50 rake = 5.83%

The average pots are usually in the $25 range, which gives you a little over 6.0% average rake.

Mack848 and Jake were suggesting that I should steal more and raise to isolate more. The only time I've really been able to isolate successfully in these games, though, is when I'm sitting to the left of an uber-LAG. That is, if I re-raise, I can actually isolate people to some degree with the pre-flop 3-bet. Much more common, though, is the weak limper. If some guy with a 50% VP$IP limps from MP2, he's probably got some trash like T7s, and then I look down at QJs in MP3, and I should raise, but then I look and the guy on the button is even fishier and is going to cold-call with his K8o no matter what, then of course the SB will call if he's sooted and the BB will call with any 2 cards, so is this still a good time to raise? Is it incorrect to go into "see the flop cheaply" mode when you can't isolate? Should I be raising for value here?

Now, if it's possible for me to win more small pots, keeping them under $20 without a rake, that's definitely good, but I fear that excessive raising would mostly be limiting the field to 2-3 opponents and the pot would often just barely break $20 where you get the worst possible rake.

Also, I'm wondering how many other people frequently play 2/4 BBJ. The games seem to be getting pretty sharky, so there have to be some 2+2ers in there. Two nights ago the JP was up to $380K and there were still very few tables over 30% VP$IP, and most of the ones that were also had an avg PFR of around 10%. I think things used to be a lot more fishy, especially whenever the JP was over $150K.
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