[curtains]

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How many outs are we counting here? Do the hearts count enough to be 8 additional outs (jack counts for straight) when you don't have the A [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]

Overs and straight are both iffy. IMO the only way this gets action is when its beat or a very close race.

If you are of the opinion that this hand has value (meaning you are counting all of your outs as live...) then why not make a value bet instead of potentially driving him out of the pot?

For curtains, do you play this the same if you have the A [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] K [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] ?

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Yes I play this the same whether my ace is a heart or not. I don't consider that my hand has value! What I mean is I definitely want my opponent to fold. However I cannot bet and then fold myself as my opponent could either be bluffing, or I will often have too many outs to justify folding once the pot is so large.

Sorry if Im not answering the question well, but IMO this is a really standard allin. I barely even look at the table to make this play. I just see the 3 hearts on the board, see that I have one in my hand and that I have only 3 times the pot in my hand, and move allin.