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Okay if u call him when he raises, if u really dont believe him. But what do u think the button is betting into a raise and caller with?

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I knew the button had 8-8-x-x. The foe was well known to me. With the nuts or a big A, he would have gone into slowroller mode. Thus, I was absolutely certain at the time that my read was correct.

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Too big of a chance that ur drawing dead (or close enough to it) to call. ONce again, even if the guy is insane, even insane players get cards.

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Very true. This is why I should have folded to the first raise. I acknowledge the mistake.

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It does seem like a badbeat story here tho.

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Actually, it was meant to be an entirely theoretical discussion of acceptable risk taking scenarios against a maniac. That probably did not come across very well in the original post and the fault can only lie with me on that one.

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I like the leadout, i might even be passive and just check and keep the pot small and see what develops, maybe hit ur boat and then get crippled. Here is the thing, when u call the button flop raise, what do u think u need to win? And if u miss (another high card or something like that) what do u do then out of position? Turn causes some problems unless u hit ur boat

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Right, seeing a turn here would have been foolish. If I really believed that the maniac had nothing and the button had 8-8-x-x, i should have pushed after the button's raise. Heads up against the made hand, I would have had 40% equity and the dead money would have made it a slightly +EV gamble. However, I wasn't sure of my read on the maniac and thus made the foolish call and then found the easy fold when the action got back to me.