[BoxTree]

[ QUOTE ]
Live at the Mecca, 9/18 nine-handed. Table is typical loose with minor bursts of aggression. Two limpers to me in BB with A [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]:K [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], I check. Four to the flop.

FLOP: 9 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]5 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]3 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]

Checked around. Still four players.

TURN: A [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]

SB (loosey-goosey) checks, I bet, EP limper (tight by Commerce standards) calls, LP limper (loosest player in the free world) calls. SB now check-raises. I call as do the others. Four to the river.

RIVER: 2 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]

SB bets. I fold...

All comments welcomed.

[/ QUOTE ]

Hrm.

Interesting hand. I like it. The hand, I mean. After I finish typing, I'll decide if I like how you played it.

Preflop: I occasionally limp with AKo in the BB at the yellow game. Usually, I limp if I'm against four or more opponents and there are at least two other aggressive players. I don't mind sacrificing a bit (or even a LOT) of preflop equity with AKo OOP. Anyhow, 9/18 is a bit of a different beast. If the players are limping in with Q4o in LP, raise this bizznatch preflop. You're sacrificing too much equity and you won't be able to make up these missed bets with your postflop play. They're going to play poorly all the way down. May as well get that extra small bet per player while you can. And don't worry about giving them the odds to chase their gutshots in big pots. Your turn aggression will take care of such problems.

So, I raise this preflop almost every time at 9/18. I raise it about 80% of the time at 20/40. (The 20% isn't "random"; that's about the frequency that I'm against several opponents with a few good/tricky/aggressive postflop bastards.)

Flop: Fine.

Turn: Fold or 3-bet. Calling is yucky. You have no idea where you are if you call. You still have two players behind you who are sure to come along for the ride for one more bet. And I like having the button on the river. If you 3-bet and get called by one of the guys behind you, you're looking at a flush draw. Or perhaps a weakly played two-pair. If you 3-bet and get called by BOTH guys, the river will be interesting. If you 3-bet and get it HU and then get 4-bet, I lay it down right there. You're drawing absolutely totally dead. And if you think you need to call a bet and fold on the river so people don't make a move on you when they 4-bet the turn in the future...you're kidding. No one at 9/18 4-bets this hand with less than a set. It just doesn't happen. Would YOU 4-bet the turn with top two??? I wouldn't. If you 3-bet the turn and get it HU, just check through the river.

I don't like folding the turn. You could be up against a crappy two-pair and have up to eight outs. If he bets into you on the river (given that you 3-bet the turn and the river doesn't pair the board), I call, but I shouldn't. He had two-pair on the turn and was waiting to see if it was going to get counterfeited. Add in the small probability that your hand is good because he's insane, and a call is only slightly -EV. And you'll sleep better at night. And if the river DOES pair the board and he bets into you...oy...but I call. He could be betting a counterfeited hand and be just totally pissed off at life.

River: So...the river is now a bitch. It's 4-handed, you're second to act, and there are four to a straight on board. Given that you didn't 3-bet the turn, this is an easy fold. You almost certainly cannot beat SB (he has at least two-pair the vast majority of the time), and even if you can, there is little reason to believe that you can beat the SB and BOTH of the players behind you. The pot isn't big enough to make a crying call here with two players left to act.

So...raise preflop.

But barring that, 3-bet the turn. More often than not, you'll lose an extra bet. But those rare times that you convince a flush draw to fold on the turn, you'll be happy that you bought those extra outs.

And then cry that you didn't make a better two-pair.