[Nigel]

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Also, the W$SD can never be too high.

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I disagree with this statement

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Huh????????????

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You have to make marginal calls to win...so if you're only 20% to win a hand in an 8BB pot, you should call, it's +EV, even though it brings down your W$SD

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If you know what your opponent holds, why would you ever see a showdown with a losing hand?

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I'm not sure why you're asking this, but I did think of an answer: You bet, he calls.

/mc

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Yeah, yeah. You could make failed bluff/bluff raise attempts. But it doesn't change the fact that you want your W$SD as high as possible. And obviously, you'd want all your bluff attempts to work, not have him call your 3 high bet with 4 high.

I can't even believe this requires discussion.

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yeah if your opponent played with his cards face up, you should rarely lose a SD, only when you bluff at the river when he's weak and he still calls

but um your opponents don't play with their hands face up, so you make estimates on what they hold, what you beat, and what kind of odds you are getting

folding the river for 1bet HU, when you win 20% of the time in a 10BB pot is a huge error .. but it drops your W$SD to make the profitable call

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Yes, no doubt. But we we're talking what is optimal, so WANTING your W$SD number to be LOWER, just so your stats "look right" is just absurd. Ideally you'd never want to lose a showdown, but a couple of people seem so stat obsessed they are missing that point and for some reason seem to think losing showdowns is a good thing.

Basically, what you don't want is a low WTSD to attain a W$SD. What you do want, obviously, is to go to showdown as often as possible with the winning hand, as that will make you the most money. Your WTSD can be too low, your W$SD can never be too high. 100% would be perfect.

This seems so basic, but maybe I'm missing something.