Thread: Was jesus real?
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Old 05-16-2005, 01:50 AM
vulturesrow vulturesrow is offline
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Join Date: Apr 2004
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Default Doubling up through Cyrus.

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Here's a more comprehensive list of writers who lived during the time of Biblical Christ or until a century after that:

Arrian, Petronius, Dion Pruseus, Paterculus, Appian, Theon of Smyrna, Phlegon, Pompon Mela, Quintius Curtius, Lucian, Pausanias the Traveler, Valerius Flaccus, Florus Lucius, Favorinus, Phaedrus, Damis, Aulus Gellius, Columella, Dio, Chrysostom, Lysias, Appion of Alexandria, Josephus, Philo-Judaeus, Seneca, Plinius the Elder, Suetonius, Juvenal, Martial, Persius, Plutarch, Justus of Tiberius, Apollonius, Plinius Secundus, Tacitus, Quintilian, Lucanus, Epictetus, Silius Italicus, Statius, Ptolemy, Hermogones, Valerius, and Maximus. (source)


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Remsberg, eh? Weak Cyrus, very weak.


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I already dealt with Joesphus and Plinius Secundus (Pliny the Younger) here.

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Thats your idea of "dealing with it?"

Regarding Josephus, no one disputes that parts of that particular passage were inserted, most scholars accept that the passage is largely accurate and were Josephus's original work. In other words, the passage still points strongly to the existence of Jesus.

You got Pliny sort of right. But your appraisal of the signifigance of Pliny is wrong. The letter from Pliny by itself is a small piece of evidence. But combined with other sources, it continues to build the case for a historic Jesus.

Suetonius's contribution is as you said relatively small. Not worth debating to be sure.

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The rest of the authors in my list, which includes the names of your list, have nothing or next-to-nothing to offer in support of a historical Christ. You will find a small primer about the non-existence of evidence of Jesus as a historical figure in the same source, linked above. But do search the library too.


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There are many reasons why those authors wouldnt have written about Jesus.

Briefly, they include:

1. Jesus wouldnt have been considered historically significant by the historians of his day.
2. He was executed as a criminal.
3. He mostly avoided the urban centers of Palestine.
4. He was a threat to the established religious order.
5. He hung out with undesireables.

Also the amount of writings available to us from the 1st century are incredibly small, so the fact that we find Jesus mentioned at all could be considered to be strong evidence in and of itself.
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