Fold AA after this flop? (200NL 6-max)
 

BB is 21/9.5/0.57 over 50 hands.

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $ BB (6 max, 5 handed) converter

SB ($544.95)
BB ($188)
Hero ($200)
MP ($151.05)
Button ($231.50)

Preflop: Hero is UTG with A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]. SB posts a blind of $1.
<font color="#CC3333">Hero raises to $7</font>, <font color="#666666">3 folds</font>, BB calls $5.

Flop: ($15) 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
BB checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets $15</font>, <font color="#CC3333">BB raises to $30</font>, Hero folds.

Final Pot: $60

What does this check/min raise mean? Should I be worried about him having a queen here? Am I playing too weak tight?

Re: Fold AA after this flop? (200NL 6-max)
 

To me this seems like the BB is looking at your flop bet and thinking that you are just betting two unimproved high cards, and are trying to take the pot: so he puts you to the test. Then again the min. raise is a little strange if this was the case. I would probably call, and see what the turn brings.

-Plummy1013

Re: Fold AA after this flop? (200NL 6-max)
 

bump

Re: Fold AA after this flop? (200NL 6-max)
 

I hate these situations and it's pretty much read dependant. Does he often c/min raise cbs? Stats suggest not but only 50 hands, if so I'd reraise to 60-70 and make that the last money I put in the pot if he calls. If he doesn't as the stats suggest then just fold. I don't like calling because you'll just face I decent turn bet and probably have to fold anyway.

Re: Fold AA after this flop? (200NL 6-max)
 

I'd bet a little less on flop, and definately do´n't fold to the check-min.raise. His min.raise is something testing you for over cards or under pair way mor often than it is a queen IMO. I'd prolly make it $75-ish proceed with extreme caution if he calls.

Re: Fold AA after this flop? (200NL 6-max)
 

You're only getting 4:1 here, so you don't have the pot odds to call. However, implied odds possibilities allow you to add at least one (maybe two) extra bets, in the unlikely event that you connect. Plus there is the additional chance that villain may be bluffing.

On the other hand, villain is fairly tight, and already called a 3.5BB raise from out of position. Given that he is tight and fairly aggressive, that is just the kind of hand that could hold QQ, AQ, KQ or maybe even QJ (though I doubt this last one at 21% VP$IP).

Personally, however, I think I call and fire at the turn. Mostly because this just looks too much like he is trying to snap off a continuation bet. You put in a healthy pre-flop raise and then added a PSB on the flop; these facts tend to suggest that you're probably not betting a flush draw (unless its AKs). Since that flush draw is the only draw that someone holding top set would be worried about on this board, villain wouldn't be risking much by just calling here and trying to milk you for another bet on the turn.

Being at least a decent player (on the numbers, anyway), villain presumably knows all this. So, if he really had the queen, I would expect him to just call and encourage you fire again on the turn.

Then again, I don't play 6-max or even 1/2 full ring, so maybe I'm just getting to be entirely too clever with this.

How is that for a clear, definitive answer?

Re: Fold AA after this flop? (200NL 6-max)
 

Thanks for the replies, all were helpful.

Kongo, after looking over the hand and having time to think about it more, I definately like the line you suggested more than the one I chose. Any hand that has me beat is very unlikely to be played the way villain played it. Would a TAG villain w/ 44 really check/min raise this flop? I doubt it.

One question though (for Kongo or anyone else who would like to contribute)...what is your normal continuation bet size? You said you would have bet a little less than my PSB here, so what like 2/3 pot? I have been trying different size c-bets for a while now, and it seems like some respected posters (TWP and others) usually advocate pot sized continuation bets on the flop. What are the advantages/disadvantages of betting the full pot or closer to half the pot in these situations? I usually like to keep it consistent, so if I am betting for value it is hard to distinguish from my continuations bets with missed AK and such. (im sure this has been discussed before but I have yet to find a detailed thread on the subject)

Re: Fold AA after this flop? (200NL 6-max)
 

I am pretty busy (trying to learn PLO) so I'll make it quick. IMO, I pot-sized bet is often very good. It really depends on the board. Basically, the more draw rich the board, the closer to full pot the bet should be IMO. On the other hand, one should be less likely to CB at all with missed overs if the board is draw rich (in practice, this is more or less only valid if it's 3-way or more). On a flop where the board pairs face cards (like this one), I like 2/3 sized bet. I want to keep the pot smallish with the board paired like this, basically because it's WA/WB and there are less draws. If this board were rainbow though,m I'd definately check.

Re: Fold AA after this flop? (200NL 6-max)
 

Good response Kongo, nice and quick too, awesome.

What you say makes sense, especially the part about keeping the pot a little smaller because its way ahead/ way behind. FWIW i feel like I have a decent idea of WHEN to make continuation bets, but I am looking to fine tune the size of these bets. One thing confused me however...

[ QUOTE ]
If this board were rainbow though,m I'd definately check.


[/ QUOTE ]

Is this what you really mean? This seems weird. I would think that betting the flop when checked to would be correct with almost any type of flop in this situation. Would you care to explain when you get a chance?

Re: Fold AA after this flop? (200NL 6-max)
 

This is a flop where you don't have to bet the full pot. It's a WA/WB situation. I think 10-12 is fine. It's gonna do the same but save you a couple dollars. That being said I bet this flop most of the time. You want value from lesser pairs, and to charge a flush draw. You also need to bet here to make future continuation bets work. The mini-raise is really player dependent. I stack a lot of players who I know mini-raise to test me and will continue to bluff, with others it means the nuts. Against an unknown I call here, call turn and only call a less than half pot on the river.