pocket pair preflop with a poster and a pack of players
 

Bodog 2/4 table full of players that are worse than the 1/2 opponents i've been facing lately at party. Lots of preflop action, lots of flop bluff bets and raises that are given up on the turn, lots of suckouts by crappy hands. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

UTG folds, hero is UTG +1 with 88. An open raise will probably be cold called in two or three places, and one blind will likely come along.

a flopped set will get a lot of flop action, but much less turn and river action unless someone catches a hand.

several villains are notorious flop bluffers, and a whiffed flop will probably come back one or two bets regardless of opponents cards.

Re: pocket pair preflop with a poster and a pack of players
 

i'd be interested in what others say who have decided to limp. i have the best hand at this point and if someone wants to cold call me with a worse hand: fine. a big pot and big action on a flopped set. i'm still raising.

let postflop be what it is and i'll handle that then, but at this point: i have the best hand and i'm getting money in now with it.

i would like to know: am i wrong?

Re: pocket pair preflop with a poster and a pack of players
 

[ QUOTE ]
let postflop be what it is and i'll handle that then, but at this point: i have the best hand and i'm getting money in now with it.



[/ QUOTE ]

Re: pocket pair preflop with a poster and a pack of players
 

[ QUOTE ]
i'd be interested in what others say who have decided to limp. i have the best hand at this point and if someone wants to cold call me with a worse hand: fine. a big pot and big action on a flopped set. i'm still raising.

let postflop be what it is and i'll handle that then, but at this point: i have the best hand and i'm getting money in now with it.

[/ QUOTE ]
You're that sure you have the best hand when you're UTG+1 at a full table?

I voted limp but I'm not married to the idea -- this hand is right around my cutoff. With 99+ I tend to raise, 88- I tend to limp. I do think limping makes the hand easier to play post-flop, if that matters.

Re: pocket pair preflop with a poster and a pack of players
 

i put it in the title, but didn't spell it out clearly enough in the question. CO posts.

Re: pocket pair preflop with a poster and a pack of players
 

[ QUOTE ]
i'd be interested in what others say who have decided to limp. i have the best hand at this point and if someone wants to cold call me with a worse hand: fine. a big pot and big action on a flopped set. i'm still raising.

let postflop be what it is and i'll handle that then, but at this point: i have the best hand and i'm getting money in now with it.

i would like to know: am i wrong?

[/ QUOTE ]

With so many people coming in to the see the flop and apparently so many people calling down to the river, it would seem that you're playing this hand mostly for set value, and because of that, I want to see the flop as cheaply as possible. Considering that there are flop and turn bluffs, you can make up any bets you've missed on later streets.

Re: pocket pair preflop with a poster and a pack of players
 

lots of people are limping here.

Are we hoping for a set or undercards? No thoughts on taking the poster's dead money early? Or is our position crappy enough to devalue what we've got right now?

Re: pocket pair preflop with a poster and a pack of players
 

i'll just look at it like this: if someone has AA-TT they would 3-bet so figuring them to call with some Ax-rag or suited overcard something, they have to suck out on me first, so no i don't think i'm playing for set value at this point. why do we assume that we're already behind?

we raise and cap TT for the same reasons: we might be behind to AA-JJ, but there are other hands we're ahead of. preflop we raise with the best hands to get in the money before people know the flop will miss them plus if we hit our set we'll get lots of action to make up for the times we get sucked out on. plus the times we flop a straight draw. and with every overcard you fold, you gain more outs rather than let suited connectors, other pocket pairs, and weak OCs in for cheap getting better odds by your limp. i'm willing to risk the 1 extra SB now. this is the way i see this hand, but others may view differently.

but one thing i think we all can agree on: where the money is lost and/or won is postflop.

Re: pocket pair preflop with a poster and a pack of players
 

310,404 games 84.561 secs 3,670 games/sec

Board:
Dead:

equity (%) win (%) / tie (%)

Hand 1: 10.4570 % [ 00.10 00.01 ] { random }
Hand 2: 10.4721 % [ 00.10 00.01 ] { random }
Hand 3: 10.5759 % [ 00.10 00.01 ] { random }
Hand 4: 10.5534 % [ 00.10 00.01 ] { random }
Hand 5: 10.5288 % [ 00.10 00.01 ] { random }
Hand 6: 10.5540 % [ 00.10 00.01 ] { random }
Hand 7: 10.5223 % [ 00.10 00.01 ] { random }
Hand 8: 10.4989 % [ 00.10 00.01 ] { random }
Hand 9: 15.8375 % [ 00.15 00.00 ] { 8s8h }

+

many opponents going to river


+

raise

=

$$$

Re: pocket pair preflop with a poster and a pack of players
 

i like it [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]