88 against blind steal - Turn Play
 

button is your typical TAG

What's your plan on the turn?

Party Poker 5.00/10.00 Hold'em <font color="#0000FF">(6 handed)</font> link

Preflop: Hero is BB with 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
<font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Button raises</font>, <font color="#666666">1 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero 3-bets</font>, Button calls.

Flop: (6.40 SB) 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, Button calls.

Turn: (4.20 BB) 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
Hero?

Re: 88 against blind steal - Turn Play
 

id take another stab, probly fold to a raise

Re: 88 against blind steal - Turn Play
 

My first instinct is bet/call, with a plan of folding the river unimproved if you are raised on the turn.

As an alternative, since you're not sure if you have a made hand or a drawing hand, you could go check/call, check/call. Works best against bluff/semibluff happy opponents. I'm not sure how good of a line it is against an average TAG, though.

Re: 88 against blind steal - Turn Play
 

[ QUOTE ]
My first instinct is bet/call, with a plan of folding the river unimproved if you are raised on the turn.

[/ QUOTE ]
That's the worst line possible.

Bet-fold seems ok here. If he calls your turn bet you're toast 90% of the time.

Re: 88 against blind steal - Turn Play
 

[ QUOTE ]

Bet-fold seems ok here. If he calls your turn bet you're toast 90% of the time.

[/ QUOTE ]

You do realize I still have the (relatively weak) flush draw, right?

Re: 88 against blind steal - Turn Play
 

[img]/images/graemlins/blush.gif[/img] It's late, I missed it.

Anyway, I'd be more concerned here about giving a free card to a bigger [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] flush-draw than making one myself. That still makes bet-call a heck of a lot better, I admit.

Re: 88 against blind steal - Turn Play
 

1. If I bet the turn, and villian raises, what range of hands do you put him on? Given that range, what's your play?

2. If I bet the turn, and villian calls, what range do you put him on? Given this range, what's your river play?

Based on your answers to (1) and (2), is betting superior to checking, or vice versa? Why?

Re: 88 against blind steal - Turn Play
 

I think, this is really a very interesting hand, as it describes a standard problem.

My question is, as the button does not know your hand, whether a check/raise on the turn is possible and will the button make fold? And if a heart hits the river, you're maybe even in front, which I don't suppose at the moment: Which bigger heart could he have, which is not already on the table? Not so much.

Re: 88 against blind steal - Turn Play
 

[ QUOTE ]
I think, this is really a very interesting hand, as it describes a standard problem.

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree, but seems like everyone else doesn't [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img].

Re: 88 against blind steal - Turn Play
 

What hands would villian wait till turn to raise here? A set seems unlikely unless it's 22, because he probably would've capped pf. A pair or two pair doesn't seem likely to me either since he (most likely?) would want to raise the flop to charge the many possible draws on the flop. If he flopped the FD or OESD, I see him raising flop (usually).

Therefore, I think it's more likely that villian has something along the lines of Ahx, AxQh, or AxJh.

What do you guys think?