getting ahead of myself.
 

Just sat down and it's my BB at 100/200 party. UTG+1 who is seemingly decent player -obi__one - 19/11/1.6 raises. SB is rafael who's a 14/10/3 who I don't know that I've actually ever played any hands with calls. I call with Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]

Flop A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]
we check, utg+1 bets, sb c/r, I call 2 cold, utg calls.

Turn 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]

Sb bets, I raise, he calls.

River Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]
He checks, I bet, he check/raises. I?

Re: getting ahead of myself.
 

Impossible to fold against an unknown here. Impossible to reraise against an unknown here.

In all honesty, the call two cold, then raise the turn line reeks of anything but a monster, and I'd probably read you for some sort of spades or something in SB's spot here...some sort of push-offable hand here.

Re: getting ahead of myself.
 

could very well be AQ, but you're not laying down your 2 pair for one bet, right?

There's a good chance the villain has put you on a missed flush draw, since you called 2 bets cold on the flop.

This is an easy call - but I wouldn't think about raising here. Anyone disagree?

Re: getting ahead of myself.
 

You holding the Q [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] makes it very unlikely that he has a missed draw. KQs is out, so he'd have to have called with a hand like KJs. 14 VP$IP? Seems pretty unlikely.

What else is possible? Well, he may have rivered it with a holding like QQ. There's almost nothing else he can hold and play this way that a Q improves.

Otherwise, he had a hand that he was thinking about 3-betting on the turn, but decided instead to just call and check-raise the river. For me, this brings AK into play. Perhaps he would have just check-called a spade, but the river blanks off and he makes the thin value raise hopiing to catch you with a weaker ace.

He could have a set of 7s, 9s, or even aces as well.

I think there is enough doubt that a call is in order. Reraising seems a bit on the crazy side.

-Eric

Re: getting ahead of myself.
 

There's a couple of things I don't understand here.

First is why no check/3bet on the flop? Just calling 2 cold seems to really advertise a flush draw, doesn't it? Threebetting with 2 opponents can't be wrong, and it puts the "monster" possibility into your range. How would you play a set here?

Second is why raise the turn? SB almost definately has an ace, and probably a decent one, so were drawing and he's not folding. Even if you get UTG+1 off a better hand, say KK or something, your not SB off of an ace, especially after calling 2 cold on the turn. Wouldn't we rather let UTG+1 draw to his 2 outer to cushion your drawing odds, unless he has exactly QQ he can't have any of your outs.

The river is tough. Your hand looks pretty weak, and his AF is skewed greatly by his VPIP (easy to go nuts when all you play is AK and big pairs). I think this is a call, but a crying call at best.

lf

Re: getting ahead of myself.
 

[ QUOTE ]
could very well be AQ, but you're not laying down your 2 pair for one bet, right?

There's a good chance the villain has put you on a missed flush draw, since you called 2 bets cold on the flop.

This is an easy call - but I wouldn't think about raising here. Anyone disagree?

[/ QUOTE ]

Man, I don't think you can call this an "easy call".

You're basically hoping he's getting desperate with JsTs, or has botched AK, nothing else reasonably makes sense. If SB has BK on a missed flush draw, there is no need for SB to be CRing a made hand.

I like lil feller's thoughts on this hand.

Nigel

Re: getting ahead of myself.
 

i call. i think an argument can be made for 3-betting, but if he caps you're cooked.

Re: getting ahead of myself.
 

[ QUOTE ]
Just sat down and it's my BB at 100/200 party. UTG+1 who is seemingly decent player -obi__one - 19/11/1.6 raises. SB is rafael who's a 14/10/3 who I don't know that I've actually ever played any hands with calls. I call with Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]

Flop A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]
we check, utg+1 bets, sb c/r, I call 2 cold, utg calls.

Turn 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]

Sb bets, I raise, he calls.

River Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]
He checks, I bet, he check/raises. I?

[/ QUOTE ]

The question here is what does the SB think of obi's play and do they have history. If SB thinks that Obi is very tight and doesn't like making his call preflop with A-Q, then I could see how the Q improved his hand. Since, you have no history of how the SB may play a medium pair here out of the SB against a player like Obi then that muddies the water as well.

I feel you have enough hand here that you have to call down. I would expect him to show you A-Q which he played passively preflop against the seemingly tight Obi. A-Q seems the most logical holding here based on his preflop and flop play. I would see no reason for him to play a set of 7's fast unless he was going for the 3 bet on the flop and C/R the turn play against Obi.

All in all what a crummy spot to be in your first hand at the table. I'm afraid you got shown a better hand... most likely A-Q... and got off to a rocky start. Hope things turned around.

Re: getting ahead of myself.
 

i think the post flop comments cover most of what i would say. however, i think Q9s vs 2 players with these numbers in a raised pot is a losing play. suited connectors i play, a pair you are getting the right price in bb, but Q9s is a tough hand to end up best in a raised pot out of position. i think it is a fold preflop.

Re: getting ahead of myself.
 

[ QUOTE ]
2-pair

[/ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
party 100-200

[/ QUOTE ]

i call.