who pays off?
 

party 5/10 6m

i raise black KK utg, CO and BB call.

flop is 345 w/ 2 spades and 1 heart.

BB checks, i bet, co folds, bb calls.

turn is the 2 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] and bb checkraises me.

who pays off?

Re: who pays off?
 

I fold this without feeling very bad at all

I've been posting that a lot. I need to find some threads where I can advise a raise so I can stop feeling like a weak tight pansy

Re: who pays off?
 

Yuck.
Without a read I'd muck it. Along with the fact that he could have an A or 6, he has to think there's a good chance you have an A because of the PFR and continued bets.

A bigger question IMO is the initial turn bet, perhaps a check through to induce a river bluff would be better here. You're giving a free card to a 5 outer, but this board is just too scary and your hand definitely has showdown value. I'd try and find the cheapest way to get there at this point.

Re: who pays off?
 

i'd tend to lean towards folding. i think a read would probably have an influence. if the guy is passive...then i'd really lean towards a fold. if he'd dumb and agro and would be cr'ing a flush draw or tp or bluffing......i may talk myself into calling down.

Re: who pays off?
 

I think the place to check is the river. too many outs to a split or his flush, he will pay off with one pair on the turn but might not bet with it on the river (this is ok with you, because you can value bet, but with a turn check you give him a free card which is worse than checking the river IMO) and you're unlikely to be raised because it's easy to put you on the ace.

if he flat calls the turn then you can also value bet the river with a read. I just think if you are gonna check,
the river >>> the turn

Re: who pays off?
 

In the absence of reads, I have little problem folding this. That said, I can think of some opponents where I would reraise.

Like DMB, I'm beginning to see weak tight characteristics show up in my game. I've found that if I fold more than a few of this type of situation in a particular session I get people playing at me relentlessly. I also play 10/20 where I think as a whole turn raises don't necessarily mean the goods.

Someone correct me if I'm way off.

Re: who pays off?
 

Easy muck for me without an incredibly strong read.

Re: who pays off?
 

haha, I know what you're saying, but I think it's more that a lot of hand posts I reply to are "oh crap some unknown 5/10 player checkraised me and I have some marginal hand" where it's a fairly easy fold [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Re: who pays off?
 

I fold.

Re: who pays off?
 

i fold this too