Dazed and confused
 

pretty loose passive table, but there have been a few recent showdowns were some weak hands won some decent sized pots. I went for the checkraise on the flop to try and thin the field.. good idea or not? Do you guys see a way out of this hand or should I have played it the way I did. To be honest I felt very uncomfortable about my winning chances with so many in, but as they say in SSH the pot was big...

Party Poker 0.5/1 Hold'em (8 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is MP1 with 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
<font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, UTG+1 calls, Hero calls, MP2 calls, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Button raises</font>, SB calls, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, UTG+1 calls, Hero calls, MP2 calls.

Flop: (11 SB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(5 players)</font>
SB checks, UTG+1 checks, Hero checks, MP2 checks, <font color="#CC3333">Button bets</font>, SB calls, UTG+1 folds, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, MP2 calls, Button calls, SB calls.

Turn: (9.50 BB) 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(4 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">SB bets</font>, Hero calls, MP2 calls, Button calls.

River: (13.50 BB) Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(4 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">SB bets</font>, Hero calls, MP2 calls, Button calls.

Final Pot: 17.50 BB

Re: Dazed and confused
 

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Do you guys see a way out of this hand ...

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Yeah. Don't play 98s from EMP.

Re: Dazed and confused
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Do you guys see a way out of this hand ...

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah. Don't play 98s from EMP.

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I don't think it's too bad a play if the table is reliably loose and passive as Hero has described. But this is also assuming you know how to play it well postflop.

To OP:

I'd bet out the flop. Between you and villain there's only one player, and two between button and you. If you C/R, you're facing only one person with the choice of calling two bets call. If you bet out and button raises, there's two to call two cold. If that plays out like that, I'd bet a safe turn card such as you got and fold to a raise. Obviously if villain just calls your flop bet, it's an obvious bet out on the turn.

As you played it, I'd raise SB and call down after that.

Re: Dazed and confused
 

That's a different hand for sure.

I won't talk about your choice playing that hand as you mentioned the table was loose and passive.

On the flop, the decision to checkraise is good, you have to do something to try and improve your winning chances with a low pair, so hopefully you knock out players with dangerous overcards to your hand. Of course, its a gamble, because if SB had a gutshot draw or better your raise was an autocall for him.

SB bets out the turn. That is an odd bet, and odd bets usually indicate that your opponent's hand might actually be fairly weak. You obviously cant fold in such a large pot, but i think you might also go for a raise to try and knock out the remaining two players on the turn. this could buy you some outs, and alsoimproves your winning chances. Im probably scared if both MP2 and Button call two cold,even more so if SB 3 bets andwould seriously consider folding the river unimproved even with the giant pot.

Re: Dazed and confused
 

This call is fine depending on the table.

Re: Dazed and confused
 

I don't really like playing this hand from MP1. You'd like to see how the tables gonna act before you put money in on this one.
Your check/raise was missapplied since one person of the Four left has allready called 1, he'll deffinately call 2.
The check/raise to fold people is more aplicable when the pre flop raiser (or the person you expect to bet) is to your immediate right. Now as a play to put more in the pot when you think you have the best hand then you played it well with the Check/raise. With a pot this big though you're not folding any straight or flush draws, with a check/raise like that.
I think I might raise the turn here unless I was sure SB had it (which I'm personally not) hopping to fold overcards that are still sticking around. Is this a good turn line here?
I think going for overcalls isn't bad on the river

Re: Dazed and confused
 

I understand what you guys are saying about the PF, maybe MP1 is a little too early for 98s, i guess im relying a little too much on my opponent's looseness to call behind me. I realize that the C/R is really only making one guy face 2 cold, but does that make the play a poor one? besides, dont I get some value out of making everyone else call one more back to them with their weak draws? Anyway, thanks for the responses so far... I'm still trying to figure this out. I guess this is one of those situations that I should not get myself into until I am more experienced. (IE by folding PF from that position)

Re: Dazed and confused
 

I think you're correct about the preflop decision; you should probably stay away from these hands in most games from that position, but I think it's important for you to understand this hand further than just that.

When the pot is large like it is in this case on the flop, when opponents call one bet already and you raise, the size of the pot has priced them in to call your raise, which at that point is a call of only 1 small bet in a pot of 18 small bets. That's why it doesnt really get you anything but a bigger pot, except you did force one player to cold call 2 bets.

Re: Dazed and confused
 

preflop is fine given description of table.
flop seems like a perfect place to "wait for the turn". your check/raise has exploded that pot for anyone to call. it is a very coordinated board, plus overcards are probably at least calling here.

turn is a raise/fold situation. you can't leave overcards in and the donkbet could definitely be a straight. i don't know what people are talking about "going for overcalls is fine on the river"- SB has bet again with an overcard- you think your 2nd pair is best and with people behind? fold the river IMO.