Two Successive Hands
 

Party Poker 10/20 Hold'em (6 max, 5 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is SB with J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
<font color="#666666">3 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, BB calls.

Flop: (4 SB) 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, <font color="#CC3333">BB raises</font>, Hero calls.

Turn: (4 BB) 6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
Hero checks, <font color="#CC3333">BB bets</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, <font color="#CC3333">BB 3-bets</font>, Hero folds.

Final Pot: 9 BB

Two hands later against the same guy:

Party Poker 10/20 Hold'em (6 max, 5 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is MP with A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
<font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, Button calls, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>.

Flop: (5.50 SB) T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 6[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Button raises</font>, Hero calls.

Turn: (4.75 BB) T[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
Hero checks, <font color="#CC3333">Button bets</font>, Hero calls.

River: (6.75 BB) 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
Hero checks, <font color="#CC3333">Button bets</font>, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 8.75 BB

Villain is unknown. I just sat down at the table.

Re: Two Successive Hands
 

I don't like hand 1 much. I don't think it will work much. I would check/call the turn. I think hand 2 is fine.

Re: Two Successive Hands
 

I don't like hand one w/ out a read. Its the kind of spot I find myself in a lot when I first sit at a table. I can say that its better to pass on this spot and pick a better one when you have more information.

Hand #2 seems ok based on the context.

Re: Two Successive Hands
 

Both of you are missing the point of hand 1.

Re: Two Successive Hands
 

[ QUOTE ]
Both of you are missing the point of hand 1.

[/ QUOTE ]


That you folded a flush draw that was reasonably likely to be live (and some overcards that have a small chance of being live) getting 9-1 closing the action?

Re: Two Successive Hands
 

In Hand 1, I would call the turn 3-bet. You are getting 9:1 to draw to a flush. Surely, there is &lt; 50% chance that he has a higher [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] or will have a boat by the river.

I like Hand 2.

Re: Two Successive Hands
 

I'm assuming you mean that you thought this was a raise with a lot of value in it. I did consider this...you were semibluffing. Do you mean that your hand has such high equity here that it doesn't matter if villain hardly ever folds? If you are, I disagree. You likely have a decent number of outs, but I do think he has to fold a lot to make a raise correct, especially because you are going to call a 3bet. If you're planning on raising and folding to a 3bet, forfeiting a draw that could be live, I think its even worse. I think check/calling is definitely the best line.

Re: Two Successive Hands
 

My point for hand 1 is most people aren't 3-betting that turn without a flush. Some people will with a 5, but it's very likely he has a flush. Knowing that, he raised the flop with a flush draw. That is the only reason I called down in the second hand.

Re: Two Successive Hands
 

[ QUOTE ]
My point for hand 1 is most people aren't 3-betting that turn without a flush. Some people will with a 5, but it's very likely he has a flush. Knowing that, he raised the flop with a flush draw. That is the only reason I called down in the second hand.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think a lot of players don't need a flush to three bet there. And since most players at 10-20 are going to raise you on the flop with a flush draw, I don't see why the latter point is so revelatory.

Re: Two Successive Hands
 

[ QUOTE ]
My point for hand 1 is most people aren't 3-betting that turn without a flush. Some people will with a 5, but it's very likely he has a flush.

[/ QUOTE ]

You're getting 9:1. If he has a flush, he doesn't always have a higher flush. He may have 5x. He may have some other unexpected hand. I call the turn.

Also, what is the point of the check-raise? It has very little semi-bluff value.