the definition of marginal, i think
 

Party Poker 2/4 Hold'em (9 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is CO with Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
UTG calls, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, MP1 calls, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, MP3 calls, Hero calls, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, SB completes, BB checks.

Flop: (6 SB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(6 players)</font>
SB checks, BB checks, <font color="#CC3333">UTG bets</font>, MP1 calls, MP3 calls, Hero calls, SB folds, BB folds.

Turn: (5 BB) 4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(4 players)</font>
UTG checks, MP1 checks, MP3 checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, UTG calls, MP1 calls, MP3 calls.

River: (9 BB) 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(4 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">UTG bets</font>, MP1 folds, MP3 folds, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 11 BB

utg is a donk mp1 a tag other than that no real reads. comments on all streets appreciated. and pls, lets keep the debate about the preflop call to a minimum [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Re: the definition of marginal, i think
 

[ QUOTE ]
lets keep the debate about the preflop call to a minimum

[/ QUOTE ]

PF call is pretty standard. Rest of the hand looks about right.

Re: the definition of marginal, i think
 

The PF call is correct here. Anyone who tells you to fold needs to rethink their strategy when they are up against against loose players.

Brad

Re: the definition of marginal, i think
 

[ QUOTE ]
Party Poker 2/4 Hold'em (9 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is CO with Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
UTG calls, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, MP1 calls, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, MP3 calls, Hero calls, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, SB completes, BB checks.

Flop: (6 SB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(6 players)</font>
SB checks, BB checks, <font color="#CC3333">UTG bets</font>, MP1 calls, MP3 calls, Hero calls, SB folds, BB folds.

Turn: (5 BB) 4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(4 players)</font>
UTG checks, MP1 checks, MP3 checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, UTG calls, MP1 calls, MP3 calls.

River: (9 BB) 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(4 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">UTG bets</font>, MP1 folds, MP3 folds, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 11 BB

utg is a donk mp1 a tag other than that no real reads. comments on all streets appreciated. and pls, lets keep the debate about the preflop call to a minimum [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]
If your confident enough to call preflop, you should probably raise.

Mike

Re: the definition of marginal, i think
 

[ QUOTE ]
The PF call is correct here. Anyone who tells you to fold needs to rethink their strategy when they are up against against loose players.

Brad

[/ QUOTE ]

I would take advice like this, but I then question what a good flop would be? A monster is obvious. A loser is obvious. What is it exactly we're looking for on the flop to make this call correct and what makes it any easy call?

Is it because if you don't flop a flush draw it is easy to get away from? What if you flop TP bad kicker? Call down? I 100% respect the advice from Gods like shillx, but want to know why certain statements are made. Brad?

Onaflag..............

Re: the definition of marginal, i think
 

I 100% respect the advice from Gods like shillx,

This is just silly.

Playing Q8s after 3 loose limpers is profitable. You aren't just playing this one for its flush value. Top pair queens is a strong hand as well. You have to know when you are good and when you are drawing to 3 outs. The key is that you should WANT TO PLAY HANDS against bad players. Look for reasons to fold when tight/tricky players limp in and look for reasons to play when loose players limp. Q8s surely has some value in this spot.

Brad

Re: the definition of marginal, i think
 

[ QUOTE ]
I 100% respect the advice from Gods like shillx,

This is just silly.

Playing Q8s after 3 loose limpers is profitable. You aren't just playing this one for its flush value. Top pair queens is a strong hand as well. You have to know when you are good and when you are drawing to 3 outs. The key is that you should WANT TO PLAY HANDS against bad players. Look for reasons to fold when tight/tricky players limp in and look for reasons to play when loose players limp. Q8s surely has some value in this spot.

Brad

[/ QUOTE ]

Thanks. Exactly what I was looking for in the response.

Onaflag..........

Re: the definition of marginal, i think
 

nothing wrong with that limp, and raising isn't bad either

i'm raising this flop with that many callers, i definitely want to see where i am

at higher limits UTG would have led the turn also, making it harder to see where you are at against him

the way you played the rest of the hand is fine