too aggressive here?
 

i bet the turn not thinking i could win it right there, but for value since i also picked up a gutshot in addition to my flushdraw and overcards. bad idea? BB was loose preflop and semi-aggressive postflop but didn't show down many hands. i figured it wasn't worth calling the river with king high even though the pot was a good size by this point.

Party Poker 1/2 Hold'em (10 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is UTG+2 with K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
UTG calls, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, MP1 calls, <font color="#666666">3 folds</font>, Button calls, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, BB calls, UTG calls.

Flop: (10.50 SB) T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(5 players)</font>
BB checks, <font color="#CC3333">UTG bets</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, MP1 folds, Button folds, <font color="#CC3333">BB 3-bets</font>, UTG calls, <font color="#CC3333">Hero caps</font>, BB calls, UTG calls.

Turn: (11.25 BB) 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
BB checks, UTG checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, BB calls, UTG calls.

River: (14.25 BB) 4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">BB bets</font>, UTG folds, Hero folds.

Final Pot: 15.25 BB

Re: too aggressive here?
 

The turn bet sucks. There's no way you're winning this on the turn.

Rob

Re: too aggressive here?
 

read my post again. i did it only for value, NOT because i thought i could win it right there. the question is, was that a bad "value" bet, based on the huge amount of outs i had (if my overcards were indeed live).

Re: too aggressive here?
 

[ QUOTE ]
read my post again. i did it only for value, NOT because i thought i could win it right there. the question is, was that a bad "value" bet, based on the huge amount of outs i had (if my overcards were indeed live).

[/ QUOTE ]

You were check-3bet on the flop. How often do you think your overcards are live again? If I were to be super generous and give you 15 outs here -- and that's pretty generous, mind you, a turn bet is still -EV.

Rob

Re: too aggressive here?
 

I didn't like the cap on the flop. Maybe it's good, maybe not. I'm sure there'll be plenty who think it was good.

Since you're drawing to either a straight or a flush, I don't understand the turn bet. You got your free card, I think you should have taken it.

I hate to give up a big pot like this on the river. But in reality, you don't have anything. Then again, it looks like everyone was going for the flush draw here. I think BB might have tried to steal the pot.

Re: too aggressive here?
 

can you really call with K high here? if i had A high i probably would have made the call. you're right, i didn't notice the flop check-3bet. the cap was bad, and i should have taken the free card on the turn. if i noticed the check-3bet, there's no way i'd consider my overcards to be live. guess i was getting tired!

Re: too aggressive here?
 

On the flop the raise was good but capping the betting on overcards + 2nd nut flush draw is overly aggressive and has to be a -EV play. Leading the turn could have cost you another BB... good fold on the river.

Re: too aggressive here?
 

Capping this flop and betting out on the turn is borderline maniac, IMO. After BB's CR you should have slowed way down.

Re: too aggressive here?
 

Entity,

This type of situation is not uncommon....flush draw with a somewhat raggedy board but the BB play on the flop makes it interesting. I think I misplay these types of hands more often than not. What would you say about my proposed line for this?

FLOP - I value raise with the intent to call a re-raise by the orignal raiser with my K flush draw and BD str8 draw. I would call the re-raise from the BB (but don't like it [img]/images/graemlins/mad.gif[/img]). The BB could easily have called a PF raise with any suited or pocket pair giving him a weak 2 pair or trips. TPGK is also a possibility but would BB check-raise this? I would be thinking that my flush draw is vulnerable to the BB who may fillup by the river.

TURN - I would check-call fearing a re-raise and I want to get to the river as cheaply as possible. I am not ahead.

RIVER - I would check-fold. If the flush hit without pairing the board, I would bet, raise, and cap paying the A flush if it's out there. If the flush hit but paired the board, I would bet and call a raise.

Is my thinking OK?

(Sorry darkhorse..don't mean to hijack your thread. I might also have played it similarly to you without having a leisurely amount of time to think about it.)

Re: too aggressive here?
 

Because we have position, the cap on the flop isn't really that bad. Checking the turn, though, is the reward for that cap, and we should take it.

Rob